7 ms·

I'll play devils advocate and say mushrooms have not really helped me at all, and in many situations where I've been ~ stable ~ or mostly okay, they've dredged

by cglan 4y ago

I'll play devils advocate and say mushrooms have not really helped me at all, and in many situations where I've been ~ stable ~ or mostly okay, they've dredged up a lot of feelings and emotions and traumas that I managed to tuck away very nicely, brought it all up to the surface and then proceeded to make me erratic and depressed and overly moody for months on end. I find that often times the extraordinary ability to be introspective on mushrooms is a detriment. I have the same issue with a lot of the push to be introspective lately. It keeps me in my head and away from properly enjoying things. I think mushrooms can be a good tool, and at worst a fun drug but they're not a cure all and they don't work for everyone.

deurruti 4y ago
Get comfortable with being uncomfortable
- GameOfFrowns 4y ago
  While your advice sounds totally reasonable, it's at the same time incredibly dismissive. In my opinion, it's not much different from "Have you tried being confident/not being depressive, bro?" If you need courage to face your demons but only facing those demons will give you the courage to do the thing in the first place, then how to solve that circular dependency?
roflyear 4y ago
My goal for 2023 is to be less self aware, really! Too much self awareness...
- cglan 4y ago
  It's funny but this is my goal too. I couldn't agree more
  - roflyear 4y ago
    Much love, buddy!
- 09bjb 4y ago
  Do you want to be less aware in general? Or spend less time ruminating about aspects of your own personality? I found the book "Self Awareness" by Red Hawk pretty helpful in disentangling and disambiguating some of this stuff.
  - roflyear 4y ago
    It would be good to think about stuff a little less. Do you mean "Self Observation" ?
- BurningFrog 4y ago
  If it helps, I'm not aware of you at all!
papascrubs 4y ago
TBH I prefer a macrodose. It's great as a tool if you want to be introspective and change. But I agree that microdosing, at least for me would drive me to be too introspective at times. Balance is good. I've found psychedelics more useful as a point in time tool than as a constant. Macro w/ a goal works better for me than a micro dose.
hlk 4y ago
Being mindful and being introspective are two different things. Most people experience anxiety (including me) from being introspective since they fail to let go feelings after experiencing them. This is a skill that requires exercise and IMO psychedelics are helpful to change the game and let people exercise this.
gdss 4y ago
Had you practiced meditation for a reasonable period of time before having done the shrooms? Preparing the mind is crucial to using psychedelics responsibly and avoiding that the negative emotions that come up take over you
- slibhb 4y ago
  I find comments like this irritating. If someone wants to say "I dropped acid and it helped me," fine. People are allowed to share personal experiences, though it's a mistake to universalize them. But this "oh you didn't meditate enough" or whatever is such nonsense. It's a claim about these drugs and how they work that you have no grounds to make.
  - joombaga 4y ago
    It also ignores the potential negative side effects of meditation. It's not without its own risks.
    - aatd86 4y ago
      What are the side effects? Isn't meditation just observing one's own thoughts? Metathinking if you will?
      - deleted 4y ago
        [deleted]
      - criddell 4y ago
        I had never heard of anything either so I googled it and there’s quite a bit out there. Meditation induced psychosis seems to be a particularly bad outcome. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8380174/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8380174/
      - pc2g4d 4y ago
        I had to stop meditating for a while because of the disturbing shit that would surface during it. Still happens sometimes, but I'm more ready for it now, and see it as part of the benefit. Had to change my mindset, though.
y-c-o-m-b 4y ago
I've only taken shrooms once and didn't change anything for me either psychologically. I feel like Salvia helped a little bit with enlightenment, but I had to take it semi-regularly. What did change was the onset of HPPD: https://eyewiki.aao.org/Hallucinogen_Persisting_Perception_Disorder https://eyewiki.aao.org/Hallucinogen_Persisting_Perception_D... I haven't taken any hallucinogens in over a decade, but my HPPD symptoms still persist to this day. I have visual snow syndrome, warping, palinopsia/tracers, and phosphenes. They're not debilitating, but extremely annoying and for a lot of people it sends them into suicidal ideation or panic. As with everything else, YMMV. You might be perfectly fine or you might be one of the rare ones like me that acquire unexpected side effects despite the fact that many people tout these drugs as having mild or temporary effects. Choose wisely.
- brnaftr361 4y ago
  I had HPPD for a minute when I was 19. I haven't replicated, but I went really hard into DHA enriched soy milk for a while. I don't know if there's anything there to really connect it, but my symptoms resolved. Phytoestrogens may have done something, and the DHA may have done something, perhaps a combination, or maybe the AA profile of the milk... Or maybe it was just rebound capacity thanks to my young age (admittedly the most probable explanation). This is despite continuing drug use. I also did a lot of meditation, and pretty extensive sessions (40-60m) of it for a few months. Some things to consider if you're interested.
  - y-c-o-m-b 4y ago
    I've taken DHA enriched soy milk, so unfortunately that didn't help. Based on the link I posted, there's two types of HPPD. Type 1 is temporary and recovers, type 2 is chronic. I have type 2. I haven't tried any of the prescription meds though as most doctors are unfamiliar with this condition and the one neuro-ophthalmologist (who was hands down the best doc ever) I saw is no longer in practice sadly.
- PragmaticPulp 4y ago
  I think HPPD is going to get a lot more attention as psychedelics continue to grow in mainstream popularity. The significance of HPPD as a potential long-lasting side effect of psychedelic use has been downplayed a lot in the past, but I've been seeing more uptake of the topic in mainstream discussions. Andrew Callaghan of "ALL GAS NO BRAKES" suffers from HPPD and has started to discuss it openly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUbod5t_2oM&t=1247s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUbod5t_2oM&t=1247s I think hearing HPPD stories from popular media figures like Callaghan can help seed healthy discussions about the risks of psychedelic use. In the past few years, the media has been way too optimistic about the potential positives of psychedelics while almost ignoring the risks and downsides.
FactoryReboot 4y ago
“ I managed to tuck away very nicely“ There is a fine line between compartmentalization and repression.
- cglan 4y ago
  for sure, but these memories only bother me with the extremely heightened emotions that mushrooms give me, not normally so it really doesn't feel like something I'm repressing. It already feels dealt with and in the past, it just doesn't need to be brought up
  - soulofmischief 4y ago
    If the trauma surfaces and you have a negative reaction, it's likely the trauma could still be affecting your behavior and thus your life in some way. It's your decision if the pros outweigh the cons in your situation, but in my experience tackling trauma head-on in a safe environment has measurably improved my overall health.
    - dkiok21k 4y ago
      Even "worse", unresolved trauma affects people around you negatively, whereas it is typical that you have a blind spot for how exactly until you face it. I really strongly urge everyone to work on unresolved trauma, and not keep it "tucked away", even if it may feel like you have it under control and it is "not affecting you in any way".
  - spoiler 4y ago
    As someone who had a similar mindset about my childhood, I'd like to share that you might be wrong in thinking they're "resolved" if "dredging them up" still stirs negative emotions in you. Also, even if it doesn't directly, there are other parts of your daily life that it might insidiously influence without you even noticing. So, if you have never talked to someone about these things (I'd suggest a professional, friends and family can inadvertently cause trauma reactivation by offering help or advice, and that can be very dangerous depending on the trauma, especially if gaslighting was involved). But regarding mushrooms: on their own, I believe they're not that useful for healing. I have a (layman's) theory that post-trip therapy is probably more successful due to increased neuroplasticity of the brain[1]. There was also some research that suggested the DMN gets a bit "scrambled"[2], so another of my layman's theories is that it's able to reach a new "equilibrium" once it was kicked into this unstable state. [1]: https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.17.431629v1.full https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.17.431629v1...., and a more easily digested version is here https://www.sciencealert.com/one-dose-of-psilocybin-regrows-lost-brain-connections-in-mice https://www.sciencealert.com/one-dose-of-psilocybin-regrows-... [2]: Can't find the thing I was thinking of now, but googling "psilocybin dmn" will yield some interesting reads regardless!
kinakomochidayo 4y ago
Huh interesting. If I was in the same position, I would’ve started talking to a therapist and start processing the past just so I won’t have to deal with it later in the future.
- cglan 4y ago
  sometimes I'd agree, but like I replied a bit lower, these memories only bother me with the extremely heightened emotions that mushrooms give me, not normally so it really doesn't feel like something I'm repressing. It already feels dealt with and in the past, it just doesn't need to be brought up. Sometimes things are in the past and they are perfectly good staying there
riskneutral 4y ago
So it didn't do much for you. I know many people who report similar experiences. Like OP, for me personally it has profound effects on me and helps me improve and maintain my mental health. Everyone is different.
- aryamaan 4y ago
  I wish it has worked similarly for me. When I tried them first, it did feel like I was having a profound experience. But that lasted only for a week or so. After 2-3 months and giving it another try did not replicate that experience. In addition to it, if anything it lasted for that trip only. Maybe I should have done something during the trip. I was just watching a movie being cozy at home.
yarg 4y ago
> at worst a fun drug Mushrooms pulled me back from the precipice of suicide, I will never stop advocating for their usage and legalisation - but this is dangerously wrong. At worst they can shoot you into a horror space from which you will not return, and that needs to be considered before taking them. There's also a danger zone (Lana) in between a medium dose and a large dose, in which you're not so incapacitated as to be immobile, but too incapacitated to accurately judge reality.

by cglan 4y ago

deurruti 4y ago

Get comfortable with being uncomfortable

GameOfFrowns 4y ago
While your advice sounds totally reasonable, it's at the same time incredibly dismissive. In my opinion, it's not much different from "Have you tried being confident/not being depressive, bro?" If you need courage to face your demons but only facing those demons will give you the courage to do the thing in the first place, then how to solve that circular dependency?

roflyear 4y ago

My goal for 2023 is to be less self aware, really! Too much self awareness...

cglan 4y ago
It's funny but this is my goal too. I couldn't agree more
- roflyear 4y ago
  Much love, buddy!
09bjb 4y ago
Do you want to be less aware in general? Or spend less time ruminating about aspects of your own personality? I found the book "Self Awareness" by Red Hawk pretty helpful in disentangling and disambiguating some of this stuff.
- roflyear 4y ago
  It would be good to think about stuff a little less. Do you mean "Self Observation" ?
BurningFrog 4y ago
If it helps, I'm not aware of you at all!

papascrubs 4y ago

TBH I prefer a macrodose. It's great as a tool if you want to be introspective and change. But I agree that microdosing, at least for me would drive me to be too introspective at times. Balance is good. I've found psychedelics more useful as a point in time tool than as a constant. Macro w/ a goal works better for me than a micro dose.

hlk 4y ago

Being mindful and being introspective are two different things. Most people experience anxiety (including me) from being introspective since they fail to let go feelings after experiencing them. This is a skill that requires exercise and IMO psychedelics are helpful to change the game and let people exercise this.

gdss 4y ago

Had you practiced meditation for a reasonable period of time before having done the shrooms? Preparing the mind is crucial to using psychedelics responsibly and avoiding that the negative emotions that come up take over you

slibhb 4y ago
I find comments like this irritating. If someone wants to say "I dropped acid and it helped me," fine. People are allowed to share personal experiences, though it's a mistake to universalize them. But this "oh you didn't meditate enough" or whatever is such nonsense. It's a claim about these drugs and how they work that you have no grounds to make.
- joombaga 4y ago
  It also ignores the potential negative side effects of meditation. It's not without its own risks.
  - aatd86 4y ago
    What are the side effects? Isn't meditation just observing one's own thoughts? Metathinking if you will?
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - criddell 4y ago
      I had never heard of anything either so I googled it and there’s quite a bit out there. Meditation induced psychosis seems to be a particularly bad outcome. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8380174/ https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8380174/
    - pc2g4d 4y ago
      I had to stop meditating for a while because of the disturbing shit that would surface during it. Still happens sometimes, but I'm more ready for it now, and see it as part of the benefit. Had to change my mindset, though.

y-c-o-m-b 4y ago

I've only taken shrooms once and didn't change anything for me either psychologically. I feel like Salvia helped a little bit with enlightenment, but I had to take it semi-regularly. What did change was the onset of HPPD: https://eyewiki.aao.org/Hallucinogen_Persisting_Perception_Disorder https://eyewiki.aao.org/Hallucinogen_Persisting_Perception_D... I haven't taken any hallucinogens in over a decade, but my HPPD symptoms still persist to this day. I have visual snow syndrome, warping, palinopsia/tracers, and phosphenes. They're not debilitating, but extremely annoying and for a lot of people it sends them into suicidal ideation or panic. As with everything else, YMMV. You might be perfectly fine or you might be one of the rare ones like me that acquire unexpected side effects despite the fact that many people tout these drugs as having mild or temporary effects. Choose wisely.

brnaftr361 4y ago
I had HPPD for a minute when I was 19. I haven't replicated, but I went really hard into DHA enriched soy milk for a while. I don't know if there's anything there to really connect it, but my symptoms resolved. Phytoestrogens may have done something, and the DHA may have done something, perhaps a combination, or maybe the AA profile of the milk... Or maybe it was just rebound capacity thanks to my young age (admittedly the most probable explanation). This is despite continuing drug use. I also did a lot of meditation, and pretty extensive sessions (40-60m) of it for a few months. Some things to consider if you're interested.
- y-c-o-m-b 4y ago
  I've taken DHA enriched soy milk, so unfortunately that didn't help. Based on the link I posted, there's two types of HPPD. Type 1 is temporary and recovers, type 2 is chronic. I have type 2. I haven't tried any of the prescription meds though as most doctors are unfamiliar with this condition and the one neuro-ophthalmologist (who was hands down the best doc ever) I saw is no longer in practice sadly.
PragmaticPulp 4y ago
I think HPPD is going to get a lot more attention as psychedelics continue to grow in mainstream popularity. The significance of HPPD as a potential long-lasting side effect of psychedelic use has been downplayed a lot in the past, but I've been seeing more uptake of the topic in mainstream discussions. Andrew Callaghan of "ALL GAS NO BRAKES" suffers from HPPD and has started to discuss it openly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUbod5t_2oM&t=1247s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zUbod5t_2oM&t=1247s I think hearing HPPD stories from popular media figures like Callaghan can help seed healthy discussions about the risks of psychedelic use. In the past few years, the media has been way too optimistic about the potential positives of psychedelics while almost ignoring the risks and downsides.

FactoryReboot 4y ago

“ I managed to tuck away very nicely“ There is a fine line between compartmentalization and repression.

cglan 4y ago
for sure, but these memories only bother me with the extremely heightened emotions that mushrooms give me, not normally so it really doesn't feel like something I'm repressing. It already feels dealt with and in the past, it just doesn't need to be brought up
- soulofmischief 4y ago
  If the trauma surfaces and you have a negative reaction, it's likely the trauma could still be affecting your behavior and thus your life in some way. It's your decision if the pros outweigh the cons in your situation, but in my experience tackling trauma head-on in a safe environment has measurably improved my overall health.
  - dkiok21k 4y ago
    Even "worse", unresolved trauma affects people around you negatively, whereas it is typical that you have a blind spot for how exactly until you face it. I really strongly urge everyone to work on unresolved trauma, and not keep it "tucked away", even if it may feel like you have it under control and it is "not affecting you in any way".
- spoiler 4y ago
  As someone who had a similar mindset about my childhood, I'd like to share that you might be wrong in thinking they're "resolved" if "dredging them up" still stirs negative emotions in you. Also, even if it doesn't directly, there are other parts of your daily life that it might insidiously influence without you even noticing. So, if you have never talked to someone about these things (I'd suggest a professional, friends and family can inadvertently cause trauma reactivation by offering help or advice, and that can be very dangerous depending on the trauma, especially if gaslighting was involved). But regarding mushrooms: on their own, I believe they're not that useful for healing. I have a (layman's) theory that post-trip therapy is probably more successful due to increased neuroplasticity of the brain[1]. There was also some research that suggested the DMN gets a bit "scrambled"[2], so another of my layman's theories is that it's able to reach a new "equilibrium" once it was kicked into this unstable state. [1]: https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.17.431629v1.full https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.17.431629v1...., and a more easily digested version is here https://www.sciencealert.com/one-dose-of-psilocybin-regrows-lost-brain-connections-in-mice https://www.sciencealert.com/one-dose-of-psilocybin-regrows-... [2]: Can't find the thing I was thinking of now, but googling "psilocybin dmn" will yield some interesting reads regardless!

kinakomochidayo 4y ago

Huh interesting. If I was in the same position, I would’ve started talking to a therapist and start processing the past just so I won’t have to deal with it later in the future.

cglan 4y ago
sometimes I'd agree, but like I replied a bit lower, these memories only bother me with the extremely heightened emotions that mushrooms give me, not normally so it really doesn't feel like something I'm repressing. It already feels dealt with and in the past, it just doesn't need to be brought up. Sometimes things are in the past and they are perfectly good staying there

riskneutral 4y ago

So it didn't do much for you. I know many people who report similar experiences. Like OP, for me personally it has profound effects on me and helps me improve and maintain my mental health. Everyone is different.

aryamaan 4y ago
I wish it has worked similarly for me. When I tried them first, it did feel like I was having a profound experience. But that lasted only for a week or so. After 2-3 months and giving it another try did not replicate that experience. In addition to it, if anything it lasted for that trip only. Maybe I should have done something during the trip. I was just watching a movie being cozy at home.

yarg 4y ago

> at worst a fun drug Mushrooms pulled me back from the precipice of suicide, I will never stop advocating for their usage and legalisation - but this is dangerously wrong. At worst they can shoot you into a horror space from which you will not return, and that needs to be considered before taking them. There's also a danger zone (Lana) in between a medium dose and a large dose, in which you're not so incapacitated as to be immobile, but too incapacitated to accurately judge reality.