5 ms·

what is a good source for this data? their terms stipulate against scraping, but I'm curious if there is an authentic "open" source for the raw data?

Sidnicious 4y ago
Not exactly the raw data, but Twilio has a cheap and easy-to-use API for this: https://www.twilio.com/docs/lookup https://www.twilio.com/docs/lookup.
birdman3131 4y ago
https://developers.telnyx.com/docs/api/v2/number-lookup/Number-Lookup https://developers.telnyx.com/docs/api/v2/number-lookup/Numb... Not open but this is a decent option for bulk. I believe it runs $0.0015 per number. I don't believe it does the port history though
oogali 4y ago
The authoritative database is owned by Neustar[1] and is non-public. There are entities that subscribe to the service and fulfill those queries (such as unlec.com or whatever reseller they're getting the information via). But the Neustar revenue model is to charge per query which is why that site limits the number of queries one can perform. Every time you place a phone call in US or Canada, the originating carrier does a lookup against the Neustar-NPAC database (also called a "dip") to determine the routing destination for your call. Only after that response (called a "LRN" or location routing number) is received does call routing truly begin. 1: https://www.npac.com/canadian-number-portability/the-npac-neustar-lnp https://www.npac.com/canadian-number-portability/the-npac-ne...
- ridgered4 4y ago
  > Every time you place a phone call in US or Canada, the originating carrier does a lookup against the Neustar-NPAC database (also called a "dip") to determine the routing destination for your call. Is this able to determine if the phone is connected through wifi calling? (There was a discussion yesterday where some one suggested SMS may not be sent to a phone connected to wifi only if the sender did not wish to but I could not see a mechanism that would allow that determination.)
  - shrubble 4y ago
    There is a separate field called OLI, originating line indicator, that indicates whether landline, cellular or other. From memory, it's 0 for landline and 62 or 63 for cellular. I doubt you can reliably determine if on Wifi or not, although of course the carrier handling that phone would know.
    - oogali 4y ago
      They're likely referring to the data that comes out of LIDB[1] which is not a real-time indicator. Instead, it's what the carrier has stored against that phone number. The LIDB data will consist of a field that marks that phone number as a landline, broadband (aka VoIP), cellular, etc. There are some 2FA implementations you come across will look up whether a number you're trying to enroll is classified as anything other than cellular, and if so, it gets rejected. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_information_database https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_information_database
      - ridgered4 4y ago
        Thanks for the clarification. That is what I thought as well. I've heard of people being able to use Google Voice or other VoIP from 2FA even when it would normally be rejected by using a cellular number that they then port to Google Voice. Based on what I've read, some video games are able to determine if you're using a prepaid plan or post paid. I suppose they might just look up the carrier to determine that since it doesn't seem like that level of granularity is available. And the port trick may work there as well.
        brewtide 4y ago
        My work number is a Google voice number, but was my 'real' number before segmentation in hopes of gaining sanity with my phone (sidenote, if anyone is self employed and busy enough to be debating such a plan, do it, no regrets), and I've had zero issues with 2FA coming through to my once a cell number now a voice number.
4806813215 4y ago

Sidnicious 4y ago

Not exactly the raw data, but Twilio has a cheap and easy-to-use API for this: https://www.twilio.com/docs/lookup https://www.twilio.com/docs/lookup.

birdman3131 4y ago

https://developers.telnyx.com/docs/api/v2/number-lookup/Number-Lookup https://developers.telnyx.com/docs/api/v2/number-lookup/Numb... Not open but this is a decent option for bulk. I believe it runs $0.0015 per number. I don't believe it does the port history though

oogali 4y ago

The authoritative database is owned by Neustar[1] and is non-public. There are entities that subscribe to the service and fulfill those queries (such as unlec.com or whatever reseller they're getting the information via). But the Neustar revenue model is to charge per query which is why that site limits the number of queries one can perform. Every time you place a phone call in US or Canada, the originating carrier does a lookup against the Neustar-NPAC database (also called a "dip") to determine the routing destination for your call. Only after that response (called a "LRN" or location routing number) is received does call routing truly begin. 1: https://www.npac.com/canadian-number-portability/the-npac-neustar-lnp https://www.npac.com/canadian-number-portability/the-npac-ne...

ridgered4 4y ago
> Every time you place a phone call in US or Canada, the originating carrier does a lookup against the Neustar-NPAC database (also called a "dip") to determine the routing destination for your call. Is this able to determine if the phone is connected through wifi calling? (There was a discussion yesterday where some one suggested SMS may not be sent to a phone connected to wifi only if the sender did not wish to but I could not see a mechanism that would allow that determination.)
- shrubble 4y ago
  There is a separate field called OLI, originating line indicator, that indicates whether landline, cellular or other. From memory, it's 0 for landline and 62 or 63 for cellular. I doubt you can reliably determine if on Wifi or not, although of course the carrier handling that phone would know.
  - oogali 4y ago
    They're likely referring to the data that comes out of LIDB[1] which is not a real-time indicator. Instead, it's what the carrier has stored against that phone number. The LIDB data will consist of a field that marks that phone number as a landline, broadband (aka VoIP), cellular, etc. There are some 2FA implementations you come across will look up whether a number you're trying to enroll is classified as anything other than cellular, and if so, it gets rejected. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_information_database https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Line_information_database
    - ridgered4 4y ago
      Thanks for the clarification. That is what I thought as well. I've heard of people being able to use Google Voice or other VoIP from 2FA even when it would normally be rejected by using a cellular number that they then port to Google Voice. Based on what I've read, some video games are able to determine if you're using a prepaid plan or post paid. I suppose they might just look up the carrier to determine that since it doesn't seem like that level of granularity is available. And the port trick may work there as well.
      - brewtide 4y ago
        My work number is a Google voice number, but was my 'real' number before segmentation in hopes of gaining sanity with my phone (sidenote, if anyone is self employed and busy enough to be debating such a plan, do it, no regrets), and I've had zero issues with 2FA coming through to my once a cell number now a voice number.

4806813215 4y ago