6 ms·

You buy or found them and make yourself CEO. The real question is whether someone can be CEO of 5 companies and do a good job. Personally, I think Musk is muc

You buy or found them and make yourself CEO. The real question is whether someone can be CEO of 5 companies and do a good job. Personally, I think Musk is much better at being a brand than a CEO. But you can hide a lot behind smoke and mirrors if you're the richest person in the world and other rich people will throw money at you just to be your friend.

eloff 4y ago
Except he was also doing a phenomenal job early in his career too. It's not all smoke and mirrors or connections.
- bobkazamakis 4y ago
  ah yes, he famously had no connections before his career, and his parents were poor immigrants with only a few emerald mines.
  - joenot443 4y ago
    Are you suggesting most wealthy immigrants end up founding a litany of companies? This is a bit like attributing Wayne Gretzky's success to the fact Walter was a seasoned coach and a huge hockey fan. Obviously it helps having parents to enable your talents, but it's ignorant to pretend that rich parents alone will allow you to rise to the top.
    - IgorPartola 4y ago
      Necessary but not sufficient is a phrase that comes to mind.
    - fuckelonmusk 4y ago
  - jackmott42 4y ago
    Even if we believe his dads stories, he owned less than 1 emerald mine.
    - filoleg 4y ago
      And iirc, the overall dollar value of that "less than 1 emerald mine" was barely in mid-high 5 figures. Of course, not adjusted for dollar value at the time, but that adjustment wouldn't balloon it up to 10 times that in 2022 dollars.
- jollyllama 4y ago
  Isn't the kind of the point? Wouldn't he have had less CEO positions at that time?
- wittycardio 4y ago
  But certainly you accept that now it's just about the brand ?
  - eloff 4y ago
    For someone not on the inside to flippantly dismiss his contribution as brand only is just ignorance. There's a chance you're right, but you have no evidence to back up your assertion.
  - filoleg 4y ago
    All the FSD-overpromising tomfoolery aside (as well as a few other things that remain to be seen, like the Boring Company tunnels and Neuralink), I would say that making the first viable (and desirable; but I am ready to eat downvotes from people who will, rightfully, point out that it isn't desirable by them due to the interior not being as luxurious as similarly-priced mercedes/audi/bmw) mass-produced EV and the very recent Falcon-9 Heavy launch are kind of impossible to carry out just by the power of the brand. Especially since neither SpaceX nor Tesla had any brand power prior to actually consistently delivering the results.
- msbarnett 4y ago
  Like when they had to force him out of PayPal before he destroyed the company with his “rewrite the entire backend for Windows Server” mandate?
  - eloff 4y ago
    Because successful people never make mistakes? I'm not sure what your point is.
    - msbarnett 4y ago
      The point is that "he did a phenomenal job early in his career" rather misses that his early career is more "incredibly mixed bag containing disastrous missteps" than universally "phenomenal".
      - eloff 4y ago
        That's missing the forest for the trees, don't you think?
        msbarnett 4y ago
        No, I don't think that at all. Clearly. The Windows mandate was a colossal, world-historic fuckup that I think is indicative of his impulsiveness and representative of his capacity for making very very poorly thought through, Company-destroying decisions.
  - aantix 4y ago
    People evolve.
    - pc86 4y ago
      This isn't a question about evolution. They said he executed very well early in his career, and that's a good example of a colossal early-career fuck up (that coincidentally got him kicked out).
- eloff 4y ago
  Everyone downvoting me did worse in their career. It's easy to be a critic. But like him or hate him, you can't argue with the results that man achieved. None of us have done as much.
  - danaris 4y ago
    It's not about what he's "achieved". It's about what he started with, and the means he's used. Most of us could "achieve" a whole lot if we were born the heirs to a massive fortune, with all the connections that implies.
    - eloff 4y ago
      Yes, I'm sure his estranged relationship with his South African father gave him such an advantage in Canada and California. All those connections! That's a low brow dismissal of his achievements.
aantix 4y ago
John Carmack considers him a true engineer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQro0rkg2DE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQro0rkg2DE I think Carmack would call him out (Elon) if he thought less of him. Carmack seems honest to a fault. I don't think "smoke and mirrors" is justified.
- BaseballPhysics 4y ago
  > John Carmack considers him a true engineer. Cool. Then he should be an engineer. But he's not. He's a CEO. Ostensibly. And--and I really shouldn't have to say this--those are not the same job. So even if I buy that Musk is a "true engineer" (which I don't, by the way), that doesn't make him de facto a good CEO. In fact, it could just as easily be a liability.
- 2pEXgD0fZ5cF 4y ago
  Like many, I have a lot of respect for Carmack. But I'm not sure how his opinion on Musk is relevant. Nor do I see why I should take Carmack's opinions as gospel. When it comes to Carmack's comments on large scale businesses he says a number of things nowadays that one might consider one step away from PR talk (or business diplomacy). Such statements from him might not come from a place of dishonesty, but he certainly is not "honest to a fault" either nowadays. [1] [1]: https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/1348691869971185667 https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/1348691869971185667
- zerohp 4y ago
  Carmack should read the Hyperloop paper and see if he still feels that way.
- dwater 4y ago
  That's not the issue being discussed. His engineering capabilities are irrelevant to him running the day-to-day operations of 5 of the biggest companies in the world at once.
  - IgorPartola 4y ago
    In what universe are these the biggest companies?
lokar 4y ago
See “The Elon Markets Hypothesis”

eloff 4y ago

Except he was also doing a phenomenal job early in his career too. It's not all smoke and mirrors or connections.

bobkazamakis 4y ago
ah yes, he famously had no connections before his career, and his parents were poor immigrants with only a few emerald mines.
- joenot443 4y ago
  Are you suggesting most wealthy immigrants end up founding a litany of companies? This is a bit like attributing Wayne Gretzky's success to the fact Walter was a seasoned coach and a huge hockey fan. Obviously it helps having parents to enable your talents, but it's ignorant to pretend that rich parents alone will allow you to rise to the top.
  - IgorPartola 4y ago
    Necessary but not sufficient is a phrase that comes to mind.
  - fuckelonmusk 4y ago
- jackmott42 4y ago
  Even if we believe his dads stories, he owned less than 1 emerald mine.
  - filoleg 4y ago
    And iirc, the overall dollar value of that "less than 1 emerald mine" was barely in mid-high 5 figures. Of course, not adjusted for dollar value at the time, but that adjustment wouldn't balloon it up to 10 times that in 2022 dollars.
jollyllama 4y ago
Isn't the kind of the point? Wouldn't he have had less CEO positions at that time?
wittycardio 4y ago
But certainly you accept that now it's just about the brand ?
- eloff 4y ago
  For someone not on the inside to flippantly dismiss his contribution as brand only is just ignorance. There's a chance you're right, but you have no evidence to back up your assertion.
- filoleg 4y ago
  All the FSD-overpromising tomfoolery aside (as well as a few other things that remain to be seen, like the Boring Company tunnels and Neuralink), I would say that making the first viable (and desirable; but I am ready to eat downvotes from people who will, rightfully, point out that it isn't desirable by them due to the interior not being as luxurious as similarly-priced mercedes/audi/bmw) mass-produced EV and the very recent Falcon-9 Heavy launch are kind of impossible to carry out just by the power of the brand. Especially since neither SpaceX nor Tesla had any brand power prior to actually consistently delivering the results.
msbarnett 4y ago
Like when they had to force him out of PayPal before he destroyed the company with his “rewrite the entire backend for Windows Server” mandate?
- eloff 4y ago
  Because successful people never make mistakes? I'm not sure what your point is.
  - msbarnett 4y ago
    The point is that "he did a phenomenal job early in his career" rather misses that his early career is more "incredibly mixed bag containing disastrous missteps" than universally "phenomenal".
    - eloff 4y ago
      That's missing the forest for the trees, don't you think?
      - msbarnett 4y ago
        No, I don't think that at all. Clearly. The Windows mandate was a colossal, world-historic fuckup that I think is indicative of his impulsiveness and representative of his capacity for making very very poorly thought through, Company-destroying decisions.
- aantix 4y ago
  People evolve.
  - pc86 4y ago
    This isn't a question about evolution. They said he executed very well early in his career, and that's a good example of a colossal early-career fuck up (that coincidentally got him kicked out).
eloff 4y ago
Everyone downvoting me did worse in their career. It's easy to be a critic. But like him or hate him, you can't argue with the results that man achieved. None of us have done as much.
- danaris 4y ago
  It's not about what he's "achieved". It's about what he started with, and the means he's used. Most of us could "achieve" a whole lot if we were born the heirs to a massive fortune, with all the connections that implies.
  - eloff 4y ago
    Yes, I'm sure his estranged relationship with his South African father gave him such an advantage in Canada and California. All those connections! That's a low brow dismissal of his achievements.

aantix 4y ago

John Carmack considers him a true engineer. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQro0rkg2DE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IQro0rkg2DE I think Carmack would call him out (Elon) if he thought less of him. Carmack seems honest to a fault. I don't think "smoke and mirrors" is justified.

BaseballPhysics 4y ago
> John Carmack considers him a true engineer. Cool. Then he should be an engineer. But he's not. He's a CEO. Ostensibly. And--and I really shouldn't have to say this--those are not the same job. So even if I buy that Musk is a "true engineer" (which I don't, by the way), that doesn't make him de facto a good CEO. In fact, it could just as easily be a liability.
2pEXgD0fZ5cF 4y ago
Like many, I have a lot of respect for Carmack. But I'm not sure how his opinion on Musk is relevant. Nor do I see why I should take Carmack's opinions as gospel. When it comes to Carmack's comments on large scale businesses he says a number of things nowadays that one might consider one step away from PR talk (or business diplomacy). Such statements from him might not come from a place of dishonesty, but he certainly is not "honest to a fault" either nowadays. [1] [1]: https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/1348691869971185667 https://twitter.com/ID_AA_Carmack/status/1348691869971185667
zerohp 4y ago
Carmack should read the Hyperloop paper and see if he still feels that way.
dwater 4y ago
That's not the issue being discussed. His engineering capabilities are irrelevant to him running the day-to-day operations of 5 of the biggest companies in the world at once.
- IgorPartola 4y ago
  In what universe are these the biggest companies?

lokar 4y ago

See “The Elon Markets Hypothesis”