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I have a modern car with a built-in satnav as well as Android Auto support, and yet I still use my TomTom 5000 - it's just better. Definitely better than crappy

I have a modern car with a built-in satnav as well as Android Auto support, and yet I still use my TomTom 5000 - it's just better. Definitely better than crappy Google Maps, definitely better than volvo's built-in maps, and it's without any kind of comparison how much better it is than Apple Maps. You get in the car, it auto-selects the destination based on the patterns it learnt(so if you get in at 7am on a workday, it automatically selects "work" as your destination. Then around 4pm, it will select "Home". At 8pm it doesn't select anything because it has no record of you going anywhere around that time usually) - something super basic that no one has ever done. And it has a lifetime subscription to traffic updates with a built-in SIM card that works internationally as well. Drove with it across Europe several times and it's still the best satnav you could have.

philjohn 4y ago
I definitely miss TomTomGo on the iPhone - it definitely routed me around more traffic jams than google does.
spockz 4y ago
Waze had this auto learning feature as well. It is agressieve in rerouting but I feel it has hit the sweet spot between saving time and the extra hassle of getting off the highway.
SoftTalker 4y ago
> if you get in at 7am on a workday, it automatically selects "work" as your destination. Then around 4pm, it will select "Home". OK, but you need GPS navigation and maps to get between "work" and "home"?
- LAC-Tech 4y ago
  Presumably they have a dense network of roads in-between, where the optimal route can change daily.
- devilbunny 4y ago
  Traffic awareness, I'd guess. I use Google just for that whenever I'm away from home (which is a small city, I don't have to go far, and I know all the alternate routes if one is busy). I already know how to get to 90% of the places I'm going in some cities, but they're the easy-to-remember routes, not necessarily the fastest ones.
culopatin 4y ago
So, does what google maps does, but can it route you around an accident? Does it show speed traps? Does it show you closed roads? Why is it better?
EwanToo 4y ago
Waze does this "trip suggestion" feature, works pretty much as you describe it Since Covid, I don't go anywhere consistently enough for it to know what to suggest :) https://support.google.com/waze/answer/9747181?hl=en https://support.google.com/waze/answer/9747181?hl=en
hotcoffeebear 4y ago
Tom Tom used to charge for map updates, which became a no-go for many. The same thing thing with built-in ones. Toyota asked 60 euro for the map updates and unfortunately no android/ios auto.. i am going between google maps / apple maps. I find routes better in google maps but i love apple maps voice indications better. I still have also a free lifetime update tomtom but it very slow to add destination etc.
- TulliusCicero 4y ago
  Man, I remember in the mid 2000's when the Toyota dealer said like $600 to update my mom's Sienna's GPS.
- cinntaile 4y ago
  > Tom Tom used to charge for map updates, which became a no-go for many. This is what led to their demise, no?
  - gorbachev 4y ago
    That's definitely why I stopped using TomTom. Like gambiting, I really liked their product. They were compact, fast and the UX was great. But Google Maps is free.
    - rapind 4y ago
      > But Google Maps is free. We need a new alternative word for "free" when it comes to advertising companies. Something short to say "the cost is too abstract and indirect to understand fully or describe, but does impact society at large". Maybe "free-ish"?
      - yencabulator 4y ago
        "Costless" or "zero-payment".
      - ferongr 4y ago
        Google Maps is "free" in the same way healthcare is "free" in many countries. The usage of the word seems fine.
fork-while-fork 4y ago
Google maps with Android Auto does auto-learn popular/regular destinations and suggests them at appropriate times. It works pretty well.
- gambiting 4y ago
  Does it? I have never seen it do it. Maybe it's only region-specific?
  - throwaway744678 4y ago
    I believe it does when you set your home and work addresses
    - AndroidKitKat 4y ago
      It learns other patterns, too (which is kinda creepy). On Thursdays, I like to swing past a local taco shop on my way home after work and when I plug my phone into CarPlay, it prompts me navigation to the taco shop; it doesn't do this on any other day. Kinda a neat feature, but it makes you wonder what else it is learning.
- msh 4y ago
  apple maps do the same and also works quite well. I miss it in my tesla.
  - speedgoose 4y ago
    Strange, I have this feature in mine.
  - caf 4y ago
    The Tesla maps do it too, when you tap on the navigation address entry there's a list of 'Suggested' which is learned based on time of day / day of week.
    - 4y ago
astrange 4y ago
Apple Maps has the feature you just described, and their maps either are TomTom or are better than TomTom.
- gambiting 4y ago
  I don't know, here in UK they just seem to be barren, with major roads still missing, they don't know about "no right/left turn" signs in places, they don't know about one-way streets......it's not a good system. I don't know how it can be using TomTom's data if TomTom doesn't have any of the same issues.
  - chrisseaton 4y ago
    > with major roads still missing I really struggle to believe that. Major roads missing from Apple Maps? Can you give any examples?
  - astrange 4y ago
    That one’s the “new map data” so it’s all original or government sources. Maybe they got tired of mapping the millionth quaint village named something like Branstonpickle-upon-Trousers.
  - neutronicus 4y ago
    There's definitely a passable road in my neighborhood of Baltimore that Apple Maps doesn't know about, and always tries to route us around until we turn onto it.
manuelabeledo 4y ago
I may be mistaken, but I think all those features, plus traffic data, are built in both Google and Apple Maps as well. Also, phones generally have larger and brighter screens, and more accurate GPS. I don’t see the advantage of TomTom here.
- reitanqild 4y ago
  Problem is, for me at least, Google is useless for predictions or recommendations. Search is still better than DDG, but way worse than peak Google. Their recommendations are all over the place despite the fact that I have been logged in permanently in some form or another since GMail where still invite only. No one else except my wife and my parents know more about me (and to be perfectly clear they know different subsets of me) but yet Google still insist on showing me the most irrelevant and annoying ads and suggest I call people at work in the middle of the night etc etc.
  - manuelabeledo 4y ago
    It sounds like you have issues with the search engine, not maps.
    - reitanqild 4y ago
      It is not just in the search engine, Google Now AI keeps pushing mostly nonsense. The most annoying thing is they had this nailed. Google Desktop Search had some bonus features like the feed sidebar that automatically predicted what I wanted to read more of based on what I had read before and it was crazy good. Search used to be amazing and these days I feel it is barely better than DDG.
      - manuelabeledo 4y ago
        Still nothing to do with maps, though.
chrisseaton 4y ago
> something super basic that no one has ever done Errr all maps apps do this.
- izacus 4y ago
  It's also important how they're doing this. GMaps in my car constantly fails to show anything useful (or even start navigation) because there's no signal in my underground garage. Such a simple thing and yet TomTom can do it and Google can't.
  - chrisseaton 4y ago
    My car's built-in navigation can use dead reckoning based on steering angle and wheel speed, so is still better than TomTom in this respect. I really think this person who is clinging to their old TomTom is a bit oblivious to what all the alternatives now do and how they do it better.
    - izacus 4y ago
      Mhm - note that with "TomTom" I now mean Android app (which has Android Auto integration) and not an old standalone device :) I've also seen that same very app as a builtin navigation with all the features (including live traffic) in a new Fiat 500e, so it seems like they're licensing the tech to car manufacturers.
    - gambiting 4y ago
      I don't know if I'm oblivious - on long drives I usually have the TomTom setup and Waze on the android auto screen - TomTom knows about traffic and issues on the road that are just not on Waze, most of the time. Also Waze keeps directing me on most idiotic side little roads, recently I nearly got stuck in a muddy road somewhere in the British countryside because of Waze because I decided to trust it. Again, no such problem with TomTom.
      - diydsp 4y ago
        waze acts as if it treats all roads as wide, level, straight paths, and expects ppl to speed on them bc it sends me on twisty, steep, narrow 25mph roads with low visibility so they canxt be sped on.
j1elo 4y ago
Very tangentially related, on the front of "stupidly useful features that nobody seems to think seriously about": The fantastic Citymapper app shows a HUGE "Get Me Home" button if you open it past 3am. Just brilliant.
pwagland 4y ago
The auto-nav feature is very nice. However others do this, Apple Maps, at least, will suggest a destination based on behavioural patterns. Tesla also have a "simple" version of this, if you are at home, it will automatically to go to work in the "morning", and in the afternoon it will automatically go "home" if you are at the office. But this seems to be location/time based, and not behavioural.
- caf 4y ago
  It also has learnt destinations based on when you go there, they appear under 'Suggestions'.
- fortran77 4y ago
  > Tesla also have a "simple" version of this, if you are at home, it will automatically to go to work in the "morning", and in the afternoon it will automatically go "home" if you are at the office. Yes, and this feature drove me crazy until I figured out how to turn it off. The two places I know how to get to are to work every morning, and home from work every afternoon! It's the _other_ places that need navigation.
insane_dreamer 4y ago
> it auto-selects the destination based on the patterns it learnt Apple Maps does this too
djhworld 4y ago
My car has in built (TomTom) sat nav too with a nice wide-screen display. The tom tom maps make full use of the screen and very legible. Android auto gets forced into this like 4:3 resolution in the middle of the screen which sucks and I can't find a way to fix it, even after looking in developer settings. People have said it's the car manufacturers fault, I really don't understand why it has to be this way though
jstummbillig 4y ago
> It's just better. Definitely better than crappy Google Maps I struggling to see how anything could be "definitely" better than "crappy" Google Maps. To me, GMaps has made navigation about as exciting as using a door knob. It works without fail, and is so incredibly mundane, that the thought of forming a strong opinion about it makes me drowsy.
- tus666 4y ago
  Does it work without fail when you drive out of range of mobile reception?
  - NavinF 4y ago
    Yes as long as I've downloaded offline maps which I always do when I leave the bay area.
  - devilbunny 4y ago
    If it has planned the route while within service, it actually does. It guided me from Vegas to Yosemite (via Lee Vining and the Tioga Pass) without trouble despite several areas of no service. It had registered the waypoints and knew where it was, even if I couldn't load any additional map data. (I had not saved the area for offline use.)
- kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
  > It works without fail So long as you have a data connection or planned ahead with a downloaded region.
  - yencabulator 4y ago
    - And don't trust the routing in the actually remote areas, and prep your drive by putting GPS coordinates in your driving route -- but that's true of the competition too. - And have a vehicle that's the size of a normal passenger car. (I used to own a special "RV GPS" that had better data on bridge heights and weight limits.)
- 4y ago
kawfey 4y ago
> ou get in the car, it auto-selects the destination based on the patterns it learnt(so if you get in at 7am on a workday, it automatically selects "work" as your destination. Then around 4pm, it will select "Home". At 8pm it doesn't select anything because it has no record of you going anywhere around that time usually) - something super basic that no one has ever done. This is exactly how Apple Maps works, for me. It suggests a destination based on my patterns.

philjohn 4y ago

I definitely miss TomTomGo on the iPhone - it definitely routed me around more traffic jams than google does.

spockz 4y ago

Waze had this auto learning feature as well. It is agressieve in rerouting but I feel it has hit the sweet spot between saving time and the extra hassle of getting off the highway.

SoftTalker 4y ago

> if you get in at 7am on a workday, it automatically selects "work" as your destination. Then around 4pm, it will select "Home". OK, but you need GPS navigation and maps to get between "work" and "home"?

LAC-Tech 4y ago
Presumably they have a dense network of roads in-between, where the optimal route can change daily.
devilbunny 4y ago
Traffic awareness, I'd guess. I use Google just for that whenever I'm away from home (which is a small city, I don't have to go far, and I know all the alternate routes if one is busy). I already know how to get to 90% of the places I'm going in some cities, but they're the easy-to-remember routes, not necessarily the fastest ones.

culopatin 4y ago

So, does what google maps does, but can it route you around an accident? Does it show speed traps? Does it show you closed roads? Why is it better?

EwanToo 4y ago

Waze does this "trip suggestion" feature, works pretty much as you describe it Since Covid, I don't go anywhere consistently enough for it to know what to suggest :) https://support.google.com/waze/answer/9747181?hl=en https://support.google.com/waze/answer/9747181?hl=en

hotcoffeebear 4y ago

Tom Tom used to charge for map updates, which became a no-go for many. The same thing thing with built-in ones. Toyota asked 60 euro for the map updates and unfortunately no android/ios auto.. i am going between google maps / apple maps. I find routes better in google maps but i love apple maps voice indications better. I still have also a free lifetime update tomtom but it very slow to add destination etc.

TulliusCicero 4y ago
Man, I remember in the mid 2000's when the Toyota dealer said like $600 to update my mom's Sienna's GPS.
cinntaile 4y ago
> Tom Tom used to charge for map updates, which became a no-go for many. This is what led to their demise, no?
- gorbachev 4y ago
  That's definitely why I stopped using TomTom. Like gambiting, I really liked their product. They were compact, fast and the UX was great. But Google Maps is free.
  - rapind 4y ago
    > But Google Maps is free. We need a new alternative word for "free" when it comes to advertising companies. Something short to say "the cost is too abstract and indirect to understand fully or describe, but does impact society at large". Maybe "free-ish"?
    - yencabulator 4y ago
      "Costless" or "zero-payment".
    - ferongr 4y ago
      Google Maps is "free" in the same way healthcare is "free" in many countries. The usage of the word seems fine.

fork-while-fork 4y ago

Google maps with Android Auto does auto-learn popular/regular destinations and suggests them at appropriate times. It works pretty well.

gambiting 4y ago
Does it? I have never seen it do it. Maybe it's only region-specific?
- throwaway744678 4y ago
  I believe it does when you set your home and work addresses
  - AndroidKitKat 4y ago
    It learns other patterns, too (which is kinda creepy). On Thursdays, I like to swing past a local taco shop on my way home after work and when I plug my phone into CarPlay, it prompts me navigation to the taco shop; it doesn't do this on any other day. Kinda a neat feature, but it makes you wonder what else it is learning.
msh 4y ago
apple maps do the same and also works quite well. I miss it in my tesla.
- speedgoose 4y ago
  Strange, I have this feature in mine.
- caf 4y ago
  The Tesla maps do it too, when you tap on the navigation address entry there's a list of 'Suggested' which is learned based on time of day / day of week.
  - 4y ago

astrange 4y ago

Apple Maps has the feature you just described, and their maps either are TomTom or are better than TomTom.

gambiting 4y ago
I don't know, here in UK they just seem to be barren, with major roads still missing, they don't know about "no right/left turn" signs in places, they don't know about one-way streets......it's not a good system. I don't know how it can be using TomTom's data if TomTom doesn't have any of the same issues.
- chrisseaton 4y ago
  > with major roads still missing I really struggle to believe that. Major roads missing from Apple Maps? Can you give any examples?
- astrange 4y ago
  That one’s the “new map data” so it’s all original or government sources. Maybe they got tired of mapping the millionth quaint village named something like Branstonpickle-upon-Trousers.
- neutronicus 4y ago
  There's definitely a passable road in my neighborhood of Baltimore that Apple Maps doesn't know about, and always tries to route us around until we turn onto it.

manuelabeledo 4y ago

I may be mistaken, but I think all those features, plus traffic data, are built in both Google and Apple Maps as well. Also, phones generally have larger and brighter screens, and more accurate GPS. I don’t see the advantage of TomTom here.

reitanqild 4y ago
Problem is, for me at least, Google is useless for predictions or recommendations. Search is still better than DDG, but way worse than peak Google. Their recommendations are all over the place despite the fact that I have been logged in permanently in some form or another since GMail where still invite only. No one else except my wife and my parents know more about me (and to be perfectly clear they know different subsets of me) but yet Google still insist on showing me the most irrelevant and annoying ads and suggest I call people at work in the middle of the night etc etc.
- manuelabeledo 4y ago
  It sounds like you have issues with the search engine, not maps.
  - reitanqild 4y ago
    It is not just in the search engine, Google Now AI keeps pushing mostly nonsense. The most annoying thing is they had this nailed. Google Desktop Search had some bonus features like the feed sidebar that automatically predicted what I wanted to read more of based on what I had read before and it was crazy good. Search used to be amazing and these days I feel it is barely better than DDG.
    - manuelabeledo 4y ago
      Still nothing to do with maps, though.

chrisseaton 4y ago

> something super basic that no one has ever done Errr all maps apps do this.

izacus 4y ago
It's also important how they're doing this. GMaps in my car constantly fails to show anything useful (or even start navigation) because there's no signal in my underground garage. Such a simple thing and yet TomTom can do it and Google can't.
- chrisseaton 4y ago
  My car's built-in navigation can use dead reckoning based on steering angle and wheel speed, so is still better than TomTom in this respect. I really think this person who is clinging to their old TomTom is a bit oblivious to what all the alternatives now do and how they do it better.
  - izacus 4y ago
    Mhm - note that with "TomTom" I now mean Android app (which has Android Auto integration) and not an old standalone device :) I've also seen that same very app as a builtin navigation with all the features (including live traffic) in a new Fiat 500e, so it seems like they're licensing the tech to car manufacturers.
  - gambiting 4y ago
    I don't know if I'm oblivious - on long drives I usually have the TomTom setup and Waze on the android auto screen - TomTom knows about traffic and issues on the road that are just not on Waze, most of the time. Also Waze keeps directing me on most idiotic side little roads, recently I nearly got stuck in a muddy road somewhere in the British countryside because of Waze because I decided to trust it. Again, no such problem with TomTom.
    - diydsp 4y ago
      waze acts as if it treats all roads as wide, level, straight paths, and expects ppl to speed on them bc it sends me on twisty, steep, narrow 25mph roads with low visibility so they canxt be sped on.

j1elo 4y ago

Very tangentially related, on the front of "stupidly useful features that nobody seems to think seriously about": The fantastic Citymapper app shows a HUGE "Get Me Home" button if you open it past 3am. Just brilliant.

pwagland 4y ago

The auto-nav feature is very nice. However others do this, Apple Maps, at least, will suggest a destination based on behavioural patterns. Tesla also have a "simple" version of this, if you are at home, it will automatically to go to work in the "morning", and in the afternoon it will automatically go "home" if you are at the office. But this seems to be location/time based, and not behavioural.

caf 4y ago
It also has learnt destinations based on when you go there, they appear under 'Suggestions'.
fortran77 4y ago
> Tesla also have a "simple" version of this, if you are at home, it will automatically to go to work in the "morning", and in the afternoon it will automatically go "home" if you are at the office. Yes, and this feature drove me crazy until I figured out how to turn it off. The two places I know how to get to are to work every morning, and home from work every afternoon! It's the _other_ places that need navigation.

insane_dreamer 4y ago

> it auto-selects the destination based on the patterns it learnt Apple Maps does this too

djhworld 4y ago

My car has in built (TomTom) sat nav too with a nice wide-screen display. The tom tom maps make full use of the screen and very legible. Android auto gets forced into this like 4:3 resolution in the middle of the screen which sucks and I can't find a way to fix it, even after looking in developer settings. People have said it's the car manufacturers fault, I really don't understand why it has to be this way though

jstummbillig 4y ago

> It's just better. Definitely better than crappy Google Maps I struggling to see how anything could be "definitely" better than "crappy" Google Maps. To me, GMaps has made navigation about as exciting as using a door knob. It works without fail, and is so incredibly mundane, that the thought of forming a strong opinion about it makes me drowsy.

tus666 4y ago
Does it work without fail when you drive out of range of mobile reception?
- NavinF 4y ago
  Yes as long as I've downloaded offline maps which I always do when I leave the bay area.
- devilbunny 4y ago
  If it has planned the route while within service, it actually does. It guided me from Vegas to Yosemite (via Lee Vining and the Tioga Pass) without trouble despite several areas of no service. It had registered the waypoints and knew where it was, even if I couldn't load any additional map data. (I had not saved the area for offline use.)
kevin_thibedeau 4y ago
> It works without fail So long as you have a data connection or planned ahead with a downloaded region.
- yencabulator 4y ago
  - And don't trust the routing in the actually remote areas, and prep your drive by putting GPS coordinates in your driving route -- but that's true of the competition too. - And have a vehicle that's the size of a normal passenger car. (I used to own a special "RV GPS" that had better data on bridge heights and weight limits.)
4y ago

kawfey 4y ago

> ou get in the car, it auto-selects the destination based on the patterns it learnt(so if you get in at 7am on a workday, it automatically selects "work" as your destination. Then around 4pm, it will select "Home". At 8pm it doesn't select anything because it has no record of you going anywhere around that time usually) - something super basic that no one has ever done. This is exactly how Apple Maps works, for me. It suggests a destination based on my patterns.