6 ms·

Another example of why we need the 'regulation' that is so demonized.

stetrain 4y ago
Hmm but if we make businesses do something that is not the most short-term profitable choice, then the shareholders may not be able to extract maximum value!
- ch4s3 4y ago
  This isn't a very good take. Business leaders are generally fine with reasonable regulations that are evenly applied and easy to comply with. The operations out there spewing methane are essentially free riding, and their competitors who don't do that probably want better enforcement. Obviously this isn't universally applicable to all conceivable regulations, but its true enough in this case.
  - ohbtvz 4y ago
    I personally don't care in any way about what business leaders are comfortable with. Our planet is burning. They should be uncomfortable.
    - ch4s3 4y ago
      My point is that businesses aren't even necessarily against this kind of regulation. The reality is that controlling methane requires a lot of unsexy followthrough and monitoring, and international deal making. This is a political failure.
rootusrootus 4y ago
We need it at the worldwide level, which is especially difficult.
- themitigating 4y ago
  Not if you use force
  - cowtools 4y ago
    it is strictly impossible to establish a one-world government through force, at least given our current technology. If a country has the army of robots needed to make it happen, then you have two problems.
    - steve_taylor 4y ago
      It’s impossible to establish a one-world government without force.
  - lazide 4y ago
    Good luck doing that on renewables and positive vibes!
    - themitigating 4y ago
      We can sacrifice for the greater good.
      - lazide 4y ago
        That ‘we’ sure is carrying a lot of weight. From the context of this thread, it seems likely most of the sacrifice would be from folks in Turkmenistan, who would be told to change at the point of a gun no? Likely leading to a non trivial death count from violence or starvation. I’m pretty sure you didn’t ask them if they were Ok with that sacrifice. To quote C.S. Lewis - “ Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth.”
jiggyjace 4y ago
'Regulation' is not a solution for countries that do not answer to the morals of the West, such as Turkmenistan, China, or Russia. Regulation should be demonized, for many situations it ends up being a hammer to a screw.
- pstuart 4y ago
  There's always leading by example, as well as incentivizing via aid. This is not to dismiss the challenge, just that we shouldn't avoid hard problems just because they're hard.
  - themitigating 4y ago
    "Leading by example " having heard that in a long time I believe it's called "virtue signaling " now. That should tell you how well that would work
    - pstuart 4y ago
      My understanding of the phrase "virtue signaling" is that it's a slur: somebody pretending to be better than others. The intention of "leading by example" was that it's ridiculous to ask poorer countries to make sacrifices that we ourselves are not willing to make.
    - fragmede 4y ago
      If the haters had any virtue to signal then they'd just do that instead. You hate the game not the player, but that's just because you're* losing it. * you referrs to people that use that stupid phrase, not you
    - idiotsecant 4y ago
      It's interesting how so much of what we used to consider 'being a decent person' is now 'virtue signaling'. It's the most cynical, worthless meme to come out of the last 50 years and that's saying a lot.
- SXX 4y ago
BurningFrog 4y ago
To regulate Turkmenistan, you first need to rule it.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
tadfisher 4y ago
Regulation? This is government overreach. NASA isn't part of the Department of Justice, so where do they get off scanning my methane emissions? They should get a warrant. Before you know it, the government will set up cameras to catch speeders. Also, my gaseous emissions are protected by the First Amendment, so not even Twitter can stop them.

Hmm but if we make businesses do something that is not the most short-term profitable choice, then the shareholders may not be able to extract maximum value!

ch4s3 4y ago
This isn't a very good take. Business leaders are generally fine with reasonable regulations that are evenly applied and easy to comply with. The operations out there spewing methane are essentially free riding, and their competitors who don't do that probably want better enforcement. Obviously this isn't universally applicable to all conceivable regulations, but its true enough in this case.
- ohbtvz 4y ago
  I personally don't care in any way about what business leaders are comfortable with. Our planet is burning. They should be uncomfortable.
  - ch4s3 4y ago
    My point is that businesses aren't even necessarily against this kind of regulation. The reality is that controlling methane requires a lot of unsexy followthrough and monitoring, and international deal making. This is a political failure.

rootusrootus 4y ago

We need it at the worldwide level, which is especially difficult.

themitigating 4y ago
Not if you use force
- cowtools 4y ago
  it is strictly impossible to establish a one-world government through force, at least given our current technology. If a country has the army of robots needed to make it happen, then you have two problems.
  - steve_taylor 4y ago
    It’s impossible to establish a one-world government without force.
- lazide 4y ago
  Good luck doing that on renewables and positive vibes!
  - themitigating 4y ago
    We can sacrifice for the greater good.
    - lazide 4y ago
      That ‘we’ sure is carrying a lot of weight. From the context of this thread, it seems likely most of the sacrifice would be from folks in Turkmenistan, who would be told to change at the point of a gun no? Likely leading to a non trivial death count from violence or starvation. I’m pretty sure you didn’t ask them if they were Ok with that sacrifice. To quote C.S. Lewis - “ Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. They may be more likely to go to Heaven yet at the same time likelier to make a Hell of earth.”

jiggyjace 4y ago

'Regulation' is not a solution for countries that do not answer to the morals of the West, such as Turkmenistan, China, or Russia. Regulation should be demonized, for many situations it ends up being a hammer to a screw.

pstuart 4y ago
There's always leading by example, as well as incentivizing via aid. This is not to dismiss the challenge, just that we shouldn't avoid hard problems just because they're hard.
- themitigating 4y ago
  "Leading by example " having heard that in a long time I believe it's called "virtue signaling " now. That should tell you how well that would work
  - pstuart 4y ago
    My understanding of the phrase "virtue signaling" is that it's a slur: somebody pretending to be better than others. The intention of "leading by example" was that it's ridiculous to ask poorer countries to make sacrifices that we ourselves are not willing to make.
  - fragmede 4y ago
    If the haters had any virtue to signal then they'd just do that instead. You hate the game not the player, but that's just because you're* losing it. * you referrs to people that use that stupid phrase, not you
  - idiotsecant 4y ago
    It's interesting how so much of what we used to consider 'being a decent person' is now 'virtue signaling'. It's the most cynical, worthless meme to come out of the last 50 years and that's saying a lot.
SXX 4y ago

BurningFrog 4y ago

To regulate Turkmenistan, you first need to rule it.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

tadfisher 4y ago

Regulation? This is government overreach. NASA isn't part of the Department of Justice, so where do they get off scanning my methane emissions? They should get a warrant. Before you know it, the government will set up cameras to catch speeders. Also, my gaseous emissions are protected by the First Amendment, so not even Twitter can stop them.