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That is, until the ease, quality and utility of fully decentralized systems exceeds the pain of the fragility and abusiveness of the current centralized offerin

That is, until the ease, quality and utility of fully decentralized systems exceeds the pain of the fragility and abusiveness of the current centralized offerings. The power of unenclosable carriers offered by breakthroughs such as Holochain https://holo.host https://holo.host is breathtaking.

briantakita 4y ago
> That is, until the ease, quality and utility of fully decentralized systems exceeds the pain of the fragility and abusiveness of the current centralized offerings. I agree. A centralized system will seek to expand to further consolidate control & create cartels which often act against the interests of those outside of the cartel. A system of decentralized components that becomes centralized can be forked to create alternative systems that address the interests of those who maintain the alternative systems. It's like forest garden management technique...using fire to create new growth & biodiversity. The mature forest has less biodiversity & will eventually die out on it's own, but a fire will clear the less "fit" organisms leaving space for new organisms to grow. > The power of unenclosable carriers offered by breakthroughs such as Holochain https://holo.host https://holo.host is breathtaking. Is the Holochain api/architecture stable or is there still churn?
jeremyjh 4y ago
You aren’t addressing the points the article made about efficiency and other selection pressures.
- agreeahmed 4y ago
  +1 - author argues that some degree of centralization is a natural property of interconnected systems to due the aggregated effects of things like preference attachment and economies of scale.
- pjkundert 4y ago
  Classic peer-to-peer networks have low connectivity. Scale-free networks are resilient (most nodes don't matter), but are vulnerable to attack (kill a few "hubs"). DHTs (such as underlying Holochain) are scale-free, but also automatically heal from attacks. Most importantly, they operate essentially unimpeded even in the face of successful network partitioning attacks. All while each "agent" (You) retain complete cryptographic control of your data and identity. And, if/when you want to migrate your data (exfiltrate), re-package the functionality (create new clients, or integrate multiple networks), or even completely fork the entire application -- all of this is at your fingertips, and no entity can stop you.
snapcaster 4y ago
This seemed like a cool project that actually had a use for a cryptocoin that wasn't pure scamming. Shame it was a scam ponzi anyway
- pjkundert 4y ago
  Hmm? SDK reaching 1.0.0, almost ready for public beta, and capable of deploying global-scale full-stack Apps without server infrastructure? Perhaps you have it confused with another project.
  - snapcaster 4y ago
    My issues with the project aren't related to the technology, but the rapacious insiders and victims who got ripped off. I know, i know, they're greedy and stupid for getting ripped off but I still feel bad for them and don't like people that do this stuff

briantakita 4y ago

> That is, until the ease, quality and utility of fully decentralized systems exceeds the pain of the fragility and abusiveness of the current centralized offerings. I agree. A centralized system will seek to expand to further consolidate control & create cartels which often act against the interests of those outside of the cartel. A system of decentralized components that becomes centralized can be forked to create alternative systems that address the interests of those who maintain the alternative systems. It's like forest garden management technique...using fire to create new growth & biodiversity. The mature forest has less biodiversity & will eventually die out on it's own, but a fire will clear the less "fit" organisms leaving space for new organisms to grow. > The power of unenclosable carriers offered by breakthroughs such as Holochain https://holo.host https://holo.host is breathtaking. Is the Holochain api/architecture stable or is there still churn?

jeremyjh 4y ago

You aren’t addressing the points the article made about efficiency and other selection pressures.

agreeahmed 4y ago
+1 - author argues that some degree of centralization is a natural property of interconnected systems to due the aggregated effects of things like preference attachment and economies of scale.
pjkundert 4y ago
Classic peer-to-peer networks have low connectivity. Scale-free networks are resilient (most nodes don't matter), but are vulnerable to attack (kill a few "hubs"). DHTs (such as underlying Holochain) are scale-free, but also automatically heal from attacks. Most importantly, they operate essentially unimpeded even in the face of successful network partitioning attacks. All while each "agent" (You) retain complete cryptographic control of your data and identity. And, if/when you want to migrate your data (exfiltrate), re-package the functionality (create new clients, or integrate multiple networks), or even completely fork the entire application -- all of this is at your fingertips, and no entity can stop you.

snapcaster 4y ago

This seemed like a cool project that actually had a use for a cryptocoin that wasn't pure scamming. Shame it was a scam ponzi anyway

pjkundert 4y ago
Hmm? SDK reaching 1.0.0, almost ready for public beta, and capable of deploying global-scale full-stack Apps without server infrastructure? Perhaps you have it confused with another project.
- snapcaster 4y ago
  My issues with the project aren't related to the technology, but the rapacious insiders and victims who got ripped off. I know, i know, they're greedy and stupid for getting ripped off but I still feel bad for them and don't like people that do this stuff