4 ms·

Lobsters is wonderful for hard-banning politic, more programming focused, but is even more groupthink-heavy in the Haskell direction which gets a little boring.

by jitl 4y ago

Lobsters is wonderful for hard-banning politic, more programming focused, but is even more groupthink-heavy in the Haskell direction which gets a little boring. Conversations on programming are usually more informed, but also more predictable. They also ban really great contributors like https://github.com/BurntSushi https://github.com/BurntSushi for “self-promotion” which is very frustrating to me. I still visit both sites and probably comment more here still. https://lobste.rs/u/jitl https://lobste.rs/u/jitl

Beltalowda 4y ago
> They also ban really great contributors like https://github.com/BurntSushi https://github.com/BurntSushi for “self-promotion” which is very frustrating to me. BurntSushi was most definitely not banned; he removed his own account.
gerikson 4y ago
BurntSushi wasn't banned, they left the site voluntarily after reading a possibly inflammatory canned passage in a moderation message. Edit to add the discussion about their decision is the most-commented submission on the site so far https://lobste.rs/s/zp4ofg https://lobste.rs/s/zp4ofg
burntsushi 4y ago
This is misinformation. I wasn't banned. And I was never warned about self-promotion. I left because I got flagged so much by my fellow community members that the web site promoted a banner that asked me to consider leaving[1]. I don't understand why people lie so blatantly like this. Please stop. [1]: https://twitter.com/burntsushi5/status/1399543042261061633 https://twitter.com/burntsushi5/status/1399543042261061633
- jitl 4y ago
  Oops! I misremembered things. I shouldn't have used your name – what I remembered is that you're gone, and other contributors who posted great content (that they themselves wrote) and good comments have also been banned for "self promotion". I conflated the two, but not maliciously/intentionally.
  - burntsushi 4y ago
    Fair enough. Thanks for clarifying. Although I have never seen any case of banning by self promotion that I thought wasn't warranted. Basically, you used my name to support a narrative that Lobsters moderation is too heavy handed. But I have actually thought that Lobsters moderation wasn't strict enough. I wanted more moderation, not less, in order to raise the level of discourse.
- PainfullyNormal 4y ago
  > This is misinformation. > I don't understand why people lie so blatantly like this. Why assume malicious intent? Couldn't he just be wrong?
  - burntsushi 4y ago
    - PainfullyNormal 4y ago
      > "misinformation" (in contrast to "disinformation") does not say anything about intent, so you're wrong to quote that part. Misinformation. Noun. False or inaccurate information, especially that which is *deliberately intended to deceive*. I stand by my statement. > I went on public record saying why I left. And there was an entire discussion about it. There was never any confusion about why I left. Which he clearly hasn't read. Not everybody lives online and not everybody is personally familiar with you and your situation. It certainly doesn't explain why you're inappropriately assuming malicious intent. > If you're still going to say things that are untrue to push your own narrative Where is he trying to push a narrative? I looked at his post history here and on Lobsters before posting. This is the first time he's ever mentioned it or brought it up. > And if my behavior is what speaks out to you as bad Yes. Even moreso now that you've explained. You could have corrected his statement without acting like the world's out to get you or that he intended you personal harm.
      - burntsushi 4y ago
        PainfullyNormal 4y ago
        From the HN guidelines: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith."

by jitl 4y ago

Beltalowda 4y ago

> They also ban really great contributors like https://github.com/BurntSushi https://github.com/BurntSushi for “self-promotion” which is very frustrating to me. BurntSushi was most definitely not banned; he removed his own account.

gerikson 4y ago

BurntSushi wasn't banned, they left the site voluntarily after reading a possibly inflammatory canned passage in a moderation message. Edit to add the discussion about their decision is the most-commented submission on the site so far https://lobste.rs/s/zp4ofg https://lobste.rs/s/zp4ofg

burntsushi 4y ago

This is misinformation. I wasn't banned. And I was never warned about self-promotion. I left because I got flagged so much by my fellow community members that the web site promoted a banner that asked me to consider leaving[1]. I don't understand why people lie so blatantly like this. Please stop. [1]: https://twitter.com/burntsushi5/status/1399543042261061633 https://twitter.com/burntsushi5/status/1399543042261061633

jitl 4y ago
Oops! I misremembered things. I shouldn't have used your name – what I remembered is that you're gone, and other contributors who posted great content (that they themselves wrote) and good comments have also been banned for "self promotion". I conflated the two, but not maliciously/intentionally.
- burntsushi 4y ago
  Fair enough. Thanks for clarifying. Although I have never seen any case of banning by self promotion that I thought wasn't warranted. Basically, you used my name to support a narrative that Lobsters moderation is too heavy handed. But I have actually thought that Lobsters moderation wasn't strict enough. I wanted more moderation, not less, in order to raise the level of discourse.
PainfullyNormal 4y ago
> This is misinformation. > I don't understand why people lie so blatantly like this. Why assume malicious intent? Couldn't he just be wrong?
- burntsushi 4y ago
  - PainfullyNormal 4y ago
    > "misinformation" (in contrast to "disinformation") does not say anything about intent, so you're wrong to quote that part. Misinformation. Noun. False or inaccurate information, especially that which is *deliberately intended to deceive*. I stand by my statement. > I went on public record saying why I left. And there was an entire discussion about it. There was never any confusion about why I left. Which he clearly hasn't read. Not everybody lives online and not everybody is personally familiar with you and your situation. It certainly doesn't explain why you're inappropriately assuming malicious intent. > If you're still going to say things that are untrue to push your own narrative Where is he trying to push a narrative? I looked at his post history here and on Lobsters before posting. This is the first time he's ever mentioned it or brought it up. > And if my behavior is what speaks out to you as bad Yes. Even moreso now that you've explained. You could have corrected his statement without acting like the world's out to get you or that he intended you personal harm.
    - burntsushi 4y ago
      - PainfullyNormal 4y ago
        From the HN guidelines: "Please respond to the strongest plausible interpretation of what someone says, not a weaker one that's easier to criticize. Assume good faith."