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>As a straight white guy, I recognised from the outset that my interactions with strangers can be less fraught than they are for people who aren't straight whit

>As a straight white guy, I recognised from the outset that my interactions with strangers can be less fraught than they are for people who aren't straight white guys. Classic BBC, everything is race and gender nowadays. Do people really live like that? Sexuality would be the last thing I think about when I talk to a stranger that I never see again in my life for 30 seconds > Additionally, I strongly suggest men in my position be mindful of this when chatting with strangers themselves. “in my position”? So straight white men shouldn’t talk to strangers, got it. Other races have to be mindful too?

AlecSchueler 4y ago
- unpopularopp 4y ago
  Do you really think about someone being hetero or bi or gay or whatever when you talk to them for 30 seconds (how do you even notice)? Especially a stranger that you never see again?
  - AlecSchueler 4y ago
    If I'm speaking to a strange woman then I'm very much aware, yes, of all the previous bad experiences she's statistically likely to have had with strange men and I'll do my best to avoid adding to her rightful discomfort.
    - nmz 4y ago
      So you either don't talk to women, or you do so willingly knowing it causes them discomfort.
      - AlecSchueler 4y ago
        Yes I speak with women knowing that there's a high chance of causing discomfort and take what efforts I can to minimise that.
  - Broken_Hippo 4y ago
    If I find them attractive, sure, but that might just be because I'm bi. It doesn't affect what I say to them, though.
  - SoftTalker 4y ago
    Some people do immediately project a gay vibe just by stereotypical mannerisms. Yeah I know that isn't always a reliable indicator, but it's something I notice. Beyond thinking "he's probably gay" it's not something I think about any more than "he has brown hair" or "she is Japanese" it's just a characteristic of the person that I notice.
- booleandilemma 4y ago
  What luxury do men have in 2022? The luxury of not being able to express feelings? The luxury of having a smaller chance of getting hired? The luxury of having a higher suicide rate? The luxury of getting constantly called out on social media? The luxury of being told to stop whining when we point these things out?
  - AlecSchueler 4y ago
    The daily luxury of speaking with strangers shit fear of sexual assault. I thought that was clear from the context Many of your other points are valid issues which are good points for discussion in other threads. Being called out for reinforcing patriarchal social norms, however, is fair enough. Don't take it as a personal attack but rather a little reminder to consider the effect your speech can have on others. If you are being told to "stop whining" for discussing the other issues that do effect men's mental health then that's a pity, but do please be aware if you're bringing them up in order to minimise or divert from the issues faced by other groups as you seem to be doing in this case.
    - brigandish 4y ago
      > The daily luxury of speaking with strangers shit fear of sexual assault. Assuming that is a typo where "without" is supposed to sit, which men have that luxury? I know a man who was raped by a group of strangers at knifepoint, so he doesn't have that luxury. Or does he? Do I, now that I know the reality beyond a mere statistic or a rumour? I just don't know what you're proposing so I'd like to hear about how it works.
      - pessimizer 4y ago
        Are you honestly saying that the man you know is statistically typical of stranger rape? Because you can't be saying that the fact that it has ever happened means that it rational for men and women to have equal levels of fear about it. Because we all know that men rape men. Here's a question, though. Have you ever sat in a group of women fearing that you would be raped?
vf10a 4y ago
> Do people really live like that? A good way to answer this question is to ask the women in your life. It never fails to surprise me the number and variety of stories every one of my female friends/family/co-workers have. Just last week one of my friends was telling a story about a guy in a car slowly following and harassing her on her way home. That kicked off a round of 'being scared by guys in cars' stories from others at the table. I somewhat understand the 'not all guys' sentiment because this behaviour also feels very alien to me. I think it is worth taking the time to understand that it definitely is 'a not insignificant number of guys' though
- mellosouls 4y ago
  Yes, this is true and a sad fact of life - but let us not forget the majority of stranger-assault victims are men and - generally speaking - these (righteous) discussions about individual safety are rarely extended to them.
  - pessimizer 4y ago
    It's more important to remember that the perpetrators are almost all men, whether the violence is from a stranger or someone well known, or whether the victims are male, female, or even one's self - suicide is far higher and more effective among men.
    - mellosouls 4y ago
      I don't see how that is more important to remember in the context of victims being discussed here. Male representation is not even acknowledged as an issue.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  I've started to think of the "True Crime" genre as "Male Horror." Most of its audience is female, and the stories are largely about normal women who walk into normal situations and end up tortured, raped, and murdered; extra points if it was by a man no one would suspect. There's also Male Horror directed at an audience of men, but it's usually disguised as a prison story, or even more directly class-coded like Deliverance. There's just this male sort of terror where a man doesn't want to hurt you for any practical reason, they're not trying to steal from you or stop you, they're doing it simply because physically torturing you directly arouses them. Men only feel that terror and that fear in prison, boarding school, the military, sports teams, surrounded by ethnic minorities or ethnic majorities, etc., whereas women simply need to evaluate every place that they enter that also contains a man, even if they know that man very well.
tdehnel 4y ago
I’m sick of it too. I think, like masking, people will eventually get bored of the performative compassion, or at least they’ll stop getting so many social upvotes for it, and move on to something else.

AlecSchueler 4y ago

unpopularopp 4y ago
Do you really think about someone being hetero or bi or gay or whatever when you talk to them for 30 seconds (how do you even notice)? Especially a stranger that you never see again?
- AlecSchueler 4y ago
  If I'm speaking to a strange woman then I'm very much aware, yes, of all the previous bad experiences she's statistically likely to have had with strange men and I'll do my best to avoid adding to her rightful discomfort.
  - nmz 4y ago
    So you either don't talk to women, or you do so willingly knowing it causes them discomfort.
    - AlecSchueler 4y ago
      Yes I speak with women knowing that there's a high chance of causing discomfort and take what efforts I can to minimise that.
- Broken_Hippo 4y ago
  If I find them attractive, sure, but that might just be because I'm bi. It doesn't affect what I say to them, though.
- SoftTalker 4y ago
  Some people do immediately project a gay vibe just by stereotypical mannerisms. Yeah I know that isn't always a reliable indicator, but it's something I notice. Beyond thinking "he's probably gay" it's not something I think about any more than "he has brown hair" or "she is Japanese" it's just a characteristic of the person that I notice.
booleandilemma 4y ago
What luxury do men have in 2022? The luxury of not being able to express feelings? The luxury of having a smaller chance of getting hired? The luxury of having a higher suicide rate? The luxury of getting constantly called out on social media? The luxury of being told to stop whining when we point these things out?
- AlecSchueler 4y ago
  The daily luxury of speaking with strangers shit fear of sexual assault. I thought that was clear from the context Many of your other points are valid issues which are good points for discussion in other threads. Being called out for reinforcing patriarchal social norms, however, is fair enough. Don't take it as a personal attack but rather a little reminder to consider the effect your speech can have on others. If you are being told to "stop whining" for discussing the other issues that do effect men's mental health then that's a pity, but do please be aware if you're bringing them up in order to minimise or divert from the issues faced by other groups as you seem to be doing in this case.
  - brigandish 4y ago
    > The daily luxury of speaking with strangers shit fear of sexual assault. Assuming that is a typo where "without" is supposed to sit, which men have that luxury? I know a man who was raped by a group of strangers at knifepoint, so he doesn't have that luxury. Or does he? Do I, now that I know the reality beyond a mere statistic or a rumour? I just don't know what you're proposing so I'd like to hear about how it works.
    - pessimizer 4y ago
      Are you honestly saying that the man you know is statistically typical of stranger rape? Because you can't be saying that the fact that it has ever happened means that it rational for men and women to have equal levels of fear about it. Because we all know that men rape men. Here's a question, though. Have you ever sat in a group of women fearing that you would be raped?

vf10a 4y ago

> Do people really live like that? A good way to answer this question is to ask the women in your life. It never fails to surprise me the number and variety of stories every one of my female friends/family/co-workers have. Just last week one of my friends was telling a story about a guy in a car slowly following and harassing her on her way home. That kicked off a round of 'being scared by guys in cars' stories from others at the table. I somewhat understand the 'not all guys' sentiment because this behaviour also feels very alien to me. I think it is worth taking the time to understand that it definitely is 'a not insignificant number of guys' though

mellosouls 4y ago
Yes, this is true and a sad fact of life - but let us not forget the majority of stranger-assault victims are men and - generally speaking - these (righteous) discussions about individual safety are rarely extended to them.
- pessimizer 4y ago
  It's more important to remember that the perpetrators are almost all men, whether the violence is from a stranger or someone well known, or whether the victims are male, female, or even one's self - suicide is far higher and more effective among men.
  - mellosouls 4y ago
    I don't see how that is more important to remember in the context of victims being discussed here. Male representation is not even acknowledged as an issue.
pessimizer 4y ago
I've started to think of the "True Crime" genre as "Male Horror." Most of its audience is female, and the stories are largely about normal women who walk into normal situations and end up tortured, raped, and murdered; extra points if it was by a man no one would suspect. There's also Male Horror directed at an audience of men, but it's usually disguised as a prison story, or even more directly class-coded like Deliverance. There's just this male sort of terror where a man doesn't want to hurt you for any practical reason, they're not trying to steal from you or stop you, they're doing it simply because physically torturing you directly arouses them. Men only feel that terror and that fear in prison, boarding school, the military, sports teams, surrounded by ethnic minorities or ethnic majorities, etc., whereas women simply need to evaluate every place that they enter that also contains a man, even if they know that man very well.

tdehnel 4y ago

I’m sick of it too. I think, like masking, people will eventually get bored of the performative compassion, or at least they’ll stop getting so many social upvotes for it, and move on to something else.