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> In my country, these opinions are uttered so openly and commonly that it does not even raise an eyebrow I don't think we should frame free speech standards b

> In my country, these opinions are uttered so openly and commonly that it does not even raise an eyebrow I don't think we should frame free speech standards based on Pakistan, if your bio is correct.

ryzvonusef 4y ago
I am indeed in Pakistan, and the point I am trying to make is, why not? "Diverse" council, right? My region comprises of a BILLIONS people, and twitter is a global website, why do you expect Twitter to ban hate speech acc to what average American internet person wants, but not acc to rules of other countries? Remember, I am not talking merely about legally limited speech, I am talking about stuff that causes societal discomfort. If it's a "diverse" council, then there are bound to be people from this part of the world. And if they give, with a straight face, the examples you see in the funzies link as example of hate speech they would like to be moderated.... How would you feel, if your tweet was blocked, and the reason given is something you, and any body from your part of the world, would personally consider to be as offense as not ending your sentence with a fullstop would be to a grammar nazi...but to the council it was considered as offensive as perhaps saying the N-word? I am talking from a purely academic point of view, but you have to realise the scope of these matters. Pakistan might not be able to affect Twitter moderation, but India? definitely, too big a market to ignore. The Gulf Countries are already investors alongside Musk, so them too. EU has already given the halt signal.
- SpaceManNabs 4y ago
  > India? definitely, too big a market to ignore My personal opinion and absolutely dissociated from my employer: I am not going to talk about economic decisions or market pressure, but free speech standards should also be not framed around India's standards. A diverse council shouldn't have to include viewpoints that are wrong. Defining wrong is certainly a difficult measure to elaborate, but free speech standards that include some religious persecution are definitely in that wrong category. Bigots will always say that they aren't bigots.
brigandish 4y ago
Isn't that the point they're making? Not that the specific utterances matter but that the freedom to utter them matters, any or all of them, your blasphemies and mine. Then we can try to have a grown up conversation about it because we've taken oppression/suppression and hence violence off the table. Real progress can then be made.

ryzvonusef 4y ago

I am indeed in Pakistan, and the point I am trying to make is, why not? "Diverse" council, right? My region comprises of a BILLIONS people, and twitter is a global website, why do you expect Twitter to ban hate speech acc to what average American internet person wants, but not acc to rules of other countries? Remember, I am not talking merely about legally limited speech, I am talking about stuff that causes societal discomfort. If it's a "diverse" council, then there are bound to be people from this part of the world. And if they give, with a straight face, the examples you see in the funzies link as example of hate speech they would like to be moderated.... How would you feel, if your tweet was blocked, and the reason given is something you, and any body from your part of the world, would personally consider to be as offense as not ending your sentence with a fullstop would be to a grammar nazi...but to the council it was considered as offensive as perhaps saying the N-word? I am talking from a purely academic point of view, but you have to realise the scope of these matters. Pakistan might not be able to affect Twitter moderation, but India? definitely, too big a market to ignore. The Gulf Countries are already investors alongside Musk, so them too. EU has already given the halt signal.

SpaceManNabs 4y ago
> India? definitely, too big a market to ignore My personal opinion and absolutely dissociated from my employer: I am not going to talk about economic decisions or market pressure, but free speech standards should also be not framed around India's standards. A diverse council shouldn't have to include viewpoints that are wrong. Defining wrong is certainly a difficult measure to elaborate, but free speech standards that include some religious persecution are definitely in that wrong category. Bigots will always say that they aren't bigots.

brigandish 4y ago

Isn't that the point they're making? Not that the specific utterances matter but that the freedom to utter them matters, any or all of them, your blasphemies and mine. Then we can try to have a grown up conversation about it because we've taken oppression/suppression and hence violence off the table. Real progress can then be made.