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In that link, why doesn't Wikipedia mention the subject's "Born" name, like they do with others who change their name? Natalie Portman, Teller, Elton John, just
by listenallyall 4y ago
In that link, why doesn't Wikipedia mention the subject's "Born" name, like they do with others who change their name? Natalie Portman, Teller, Elton John, just to name a few.
- ignormies 4y agoWikipedia's editing policy is to only include the birthname in the article if the individual was famous/well-known with it prior to changing it -- otherwise it's considered a privacy issue. Rachel Levine is listed as an explicit example of this in their guidelines. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Gender_identity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Gend...
- some_random 4y agoBecause Wikipedia tends to err on the side of respecting the wishes of the subject. For a less political example, CPG Grey's page doesn't have his legal name or photo despite them being pretty easy to find. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CGP_Grey https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CGP_Grey
- listenallyall 4y agoIf someone legally changes their name, that would indicate to me that the subject wishes to be known by the new name. Yet Wikipedia will still list the birth name.
- frenchy 4y agoPeople change their names all the time when they get married or immigrate and have no problem with their birth name's being available. I don't think it's fair to make a blanket statement about this.
- listenallyall 4y agoAnd some trans people "have no problem with their birth name being available," even if they have stopped using it. "Blanket statement," and all that...
- NaturalPhallacy 4y ago>Because Wikipedia tends to err on the side of respecting the wishes of the subject. Unless that subject is right wing. Wolf Blitzer: >Wolf Isaac Blitzer (born March 22, 1948) is an American journalist, television news anchor, and author who has been a CNN reporter since 1990, and who currently serves as one of the principal anchors at the network.[1] He is the host of The Situation Room with Wolf Blitzer and until 2021, served as the network's lead political anchor. Seems fine, right? Tucker Carlson: >Tucker Swanson McNear Carlson[5] (born May 16, 1969) is an American television host, conservative political commentator and author who has hosted the nightly political talk show Tucker Carlson Tonight on Fox News since 2016. But Tucker is labelled conservative. Founder Larry Sanger: "Wikipedia is Badly Biased" https://larrysanger.org/2020/05/wikipedia-is-badly-biased/ https://larrysanger.org/2020/05/wikipedia-is-badly-biased/ And you don't have to be right wing to see this. I'm a registered Pacific Green.
- stonogo 4y agoYou've confused Tucker Carlson for a journalist. It's a mistake sufficiently common that his lawyers have had to explain in court that he is an entertainer and his words are to be taken as opinion. Journalists and entertainers are generally held to different standards, especially in court. A better comparison would be to Rachel Maddow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Maddow https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rachel_Maddow >Rachel Anne Maddow (/ˈmædoʊ/ (listen), MAD-oh; born April 1, 1973) is an American television news program host and liberal political commentator. Maddow has used the same defense against litigation as Carlson. The 'conservative/liberal' tag is applied when a person is described as a political commentator.
- 18pfsmt 4y agoI've got no problem with your characterization of Carlson, but do you honestly believe Blitzer is an objective arbiter of truth? I don't, and I think this myth among so many in "news" media has done more to misinform people than any of the pundits who are honest about their biases. See also, Dan Rather and Brian Williams.
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- phphphphp 4y agoActors don't change their name because they're changing their identity, actors often act under a different name because they are required to have a unique name to participate in certain organisations (e.g: screen actors guild). An actor may be known as Natalie Portman but who knows what's on her passport? Transgender people are typically changing their identity, which is a different process.
- listenallyall 4y agoIn some cases, it is only a professional identity, and their legal name is unchanged. But others do change their legal name, and Wikipedia still mentions the birth name. Same with married women who take a spouse's name.
- pessimizer 4y ago> Transgender people are typically changing their identity This is not a thing that is possible, although the idea that it could be has lead to at least a few transgender women claiming in court that they are innocent of the crimes they committed before their new name and presentation.
- tomp 4y ago[flagged]
- Comevius 4y ago[flagged]
- tomp 4y ago
- Jcowell 4y agoNo one is getting offended for you saying your crush was Ellen Page.
- cmh89 4y agoI'm confused, are you saying that you don't understand the concept of being offensive, or you believe the concept of something being 'offensive' is an "ultra-woke thing"?
- chomp 4y agoIt isn't offensive, and no (reasonable) people are claiming it is. What's not appropriate, is referring to the person that exists today, as Ellen Page.
- lynndotpy 4y agoWikipedia's name policy is to include names that someone was notable under. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(people) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Naming_conventions_(... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biography#Changed_names https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biog... This includes trans individuals, such as Chelsea Manning or Elliot Page, who have their birth name in their respective articles. For some reason, these Wikipedia editorial decisions are extra controversial around trans people, so Wikipedia has a MOS section to explicitly address this in the case of biographies of trans people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biography#Gender_identity https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biog...
- listenallyall 4y agoElton John was notable as Reginald Kenneth Dwight?
- aidenn0 4y agoThe notability requirement is specifically for transgender and non-binary individuals.
- lynndotpy 4y agoThis is not true either. The "Presumption in favor of privacy" section, especially the "Privacy of names" part might interest you: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons#Presumption_in_favor_of_privacy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_livin...
- aidenn0 4y agoThere's two separate concerns: 1. Privacy of names in general 2. Treatment of people who have changed their names. For #2 there is a specific rule dealing with deadnaming: > If a living transgender or non-binary person was not notable under a former name (a deadname), it should not be included in any page (including lists, redirects, disambiguation pages, category names, templates, etc.), even in quotations, even if reliable sourcing exists. Treat the pre-notability name as a privacy interest separate from (and often greater than) the person's current name.
- NaturalPhallacy 4y agoBecause "Wikipedia Is Badly Biased" according to founder Larry Sanger: https://larrysanger.org/2020/05/wikipedia-is-badly-biased/ https://larrysanger.org/2020/05/wikipedia-is-badly-biased/
- teh64 4y agoHe thinks Wikipedia is biased because it describes (correctly) that "alternative medicine" is bullshit? And also he is a climate change denier? Why is he not complaining that there is bias against the flat earth people on wikipedia? Sorry, "scientific minorities". This article proves nothing other than the author is useless.
- NaturalPhallacy 4y ago
- rascul 4y agoI read the article and I must have missed where it's stated that he is a climate denier or that alternative medicine is or is not bullshit. Those are just two of several examples where he tries to show the lack of neutrality.