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Jython 2.7.3 Released

21 points by philonoist 4y ago

galdosdi 4y ago
I'm so sad that Python3 basically killed Jython. It was wonderful while it lasted. Not only could you interoperate Python inside a JVM, but you even got some performance benefits - no GIL! Far better concurrency and GC than CPython. I have problems at work now that could be helped a lot by being able to run some python code in a JVM, but too much has moved to Py3, it's a nonstarter. I wish Python3 had been a project to turn Jython into the official Python instead of just doubling down on shitty CPython. The JVM runtime is miles ahead of where Python's reference counting, GIL reliant GC is. Or alternately, wish they'd had the cojones to just not break backward compatibility. The things they broke backward compatibility for were a pretty sad list of minor features, like print functions instead of statements. For such small gains, so much was lost. CPython, today, in 2022, is still dealing with all this GIL baggage that could have been avoided if Jython hadn't been effectively killed off this way.
- bastawhiz 4y ago
  Probably the biggest reason none of the alternative Python implementations have taken off is a lack of compatibility with native libraries. Pypy is arguably faster and easier to operate than Jython, but it's unpopular for essentially the same reason: compatibility. I have a hard time accepting that py3k is what suffocated Jython. Pypy, pyston, and most other modern alternative interpreters all have some amount of py3k compatibility. The fact that there hasn't been investment in Jython to bring the same improvements suggests other causes for Jython's demise.
  - galdosdi 4y ago
    I appreciate your comment! I guess I am just guessing as to why Jython died, all I'm sure of is I'm sad it happened. Python on the JVM would be really helpful.
- pjmlp 4y ago
  I used it as REPL to try out stuff on the Java libraries (we have jshell now) and scripting WebSphere (eventually replaced by Liberty), so no much uses left. You can have a go at the GraalVM version, https://www.graalvm.org/python/ https://www.graalvm.org/python/
- mixmastamyk 4y ago
  Fixing Unicode hurt Python in the short term, but ensured its continued relevance.

21 points by philonoist 4y ago

I'm so sad that Python3 basically killed Jython. It was wonderful while it lasted. Not only could you interoperate Python inside a JVM, but you even got some performance benefits - no GIL! Far better concurrency and GC than CPython. I have problems at work now that could be helped a lot by being able to run some python code in a JVM, but too much has moved to Py3, it's a nonstarter. I wish Python3 had been a project to turn Jython into the official Python instead of just doubling down on shitty CPython. The JVM runtime is miles ahead of where Python's reference counting, GIL reliant GC is. Or alternately, wish they'd had the cojones to just not break backward compatibility. The things they broke backward compatibility for were a pretty sad list of minor features, like print functions instead of statements. For such small gains, so much was lost. CPython, today, in 2022, is still dealing with all this GIL baggage that could have been avoided if Jython hadn't been effectively killed off this way.

bastawhiz 4y ago
Probably the biggest reason none of the alternative Python implementations have taken off is a lack of compatibility with native libraries. Pypy is arguably faster and easier to operate than Jython, but it's unpopular for essentially the same reason: compatibility. I have a hard time accepting that py3k is what suffocated Jython. Pypy, pyston, and most other modern alternative interpreters all have some amount of py3k compatibility. The fact that there hasn't been investment in Jython to bring the same improvements suggests other causes for Jython's demise.
- galdosdi 4y ago
  I appreciate your comment! I guess I am just guessing as to why Jython died, all I'm sure of is I'm sad it happened. Python on the JVM would be really helpful.
pjmlp 4y ago
I used it as REPL to try out stuff on the Java libraries (we have jshell now) and scripting WebSphere (eventually replaced by Liberty), so no much uses left. You can have a go at the GraalVM version, https://www.graalvm.org/python/ https://www.graalvm.org/python/
mixmastamyk 4y ago
Fixing Unicode hurt Python in the short term, but ensured its continued relevance.