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America: Let's have a party. I'll bring the software! China: I'll bring the hardware! EU: I'll bring the regulation! - @paulg https://twitter.com/paulg/statu

by themgt 4y ago

America: Let's have a party. I'll bring the software! China: I'll bring the hardware! EU: I'll bring the regulation! - @paulg https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1231699385525903360 https://twitter.com/paulg/status/1231699385525903360

mort96 4y ago
And they're rather good at it, they seem to be the only major jurisdiction which takes things like privacy seriously.
- _heimdall 4y ago
  At least when they give themselves the time to be concerned with privacy. They played data privacy extremely fast and loose during Covid response.
- data_maan 4y ago
  ... and it's essential, but thankless work, as the other comments show, since an increase in privacy can't be measured in stock performance, quarterly earnings or GDP - the purely capitalist framework within which too many people (probably including Mr. Graham) think.
  - hef19898 4y ago
    Plus, all those regulations make lives harder for whatever companies he invested in.
    - data_maan 4y ago
      I don't want to bash PG, I think it's great that there are people like that. What I don't like is simplistic thinking, where regulation is bad by definition - like he does in his tweet. It can be bad, but it can also be really good if done cleverly. The losses the companies he has invested in sustain duento regulation are not necessarily "absolute losses" in the sense that it is wasted money. The are "societal costs" that need to be payed in order to make sure the companies adhere to a certain level of civility.
      - hef19898 4y ago
        At the very least, good regulations make shared markets like the EU one possible. That the EU has a tendency to over-do it is a different question. But things like the GDPR, REACH and others are actually net wins for society, and as result, the economy.
      - themgt 4y ago
        I don't think the tweet said regulation is bad by definition. The beauty of a simple < 280 chars tweet is that it can contain ambiguity and admit multiple readings. The way I read it is more like if you substituted the EU for say, Saudi Arabia. The Saudis btw bring oil (i.e. energy) to the party - but if they brought nothing but Saudi regulations would you still invite them? What "societal costs" would you be willing to pay to adhere to a certain level of House of Saud defined civility? There's a danger in the myopia of fake universalism, of believing everyone wants your culture and civilization's definition of civility enforced on them - and perhaps they will accommodate you if you're bringing a lot else to the party, but if that's all you're bringing you might simply find yourself uninvited from a lot of parties.
- endymi0n 4y ago
  It was decried and ridiculed equally at the time, but I doubt the LED revolution would have happened half as fast without the massive artificial demand created by the incandescent bulb ban of the EU. Next Up: Fossils…
  - data_maan 4y ago
    For some reason, the EU has a marketing/perception problem, whereas it more than once enacted wise laws that created the right incentives for all players.
- boruto 4y ago
  The number of cookie banners I get is directly proportional to the amount of privacy EU has.
jevgeni 4y ago
pg has a lot of bad takes
- ForRealsies 4y ago
- hombre_fatal 4y ago
  No he doesn’t. (See how boring these types of comments are?)
ZeroGravitas 4y ago
I'm assuming this is an anti-regulation joke, but it seems unironically a good thing. The EU is pretty good at regulation. and its easier to get the best from US software and Chinese hardware with sensible regulations in place.
- sebastialonso 4y ago
  Of course it is, it's Paul Graham
kingboss 4y ago
I used to have some sort of small amount of respect for pg when I was much younger. Now I've realised what a libertarian twat he is and how limited and childish his 3 ideas are which he keeps repeating under different guises he calls blog posts.
data_maan 4y ago
The EU enacted the GDPR laws and that had a worldwide positive effect. Yes, GDPR is of course not perfect, but it is much better than the previous status quo. So yes, even though the EU is ridiculed in this joke it actually makes important contributions. Perhaps the only issue is that well-designed regulation is usually so subtle that people don't even recognize the benefits, or take it for granted...
- Gud 4y ago
  In what way has GDPR been a success? It seems most of what it did was complicate web development and force annoying pop ups on everyone. I'm pretty sure Google etc. still know everything there is to know about me.
  - data_maan 4y ago
    The answer to this can be easily found online, so I'll just repeat my earlier ending: "that people don't even recognize the benefits, or take it for granted"
  - MattPalmer1086 4y ago
    The whole cookie nonsense is not caused by GDPR at all, it is actually the ePrivacy Directive. GDPR itself only mentions cookies once and only observes that they can be used to profile people. It contains no instructions on what to do about that. The majority of GDPR is a bunch of mostly sensible privacy principles, such as if you manage personal data, you have to look after it well, and not use it for purposes it wasn't collected for.
  - teddyh 4y ago
    > most of what it did was complicate web development Only for those wanting to track users. Don’t track users, it’s all good, ignore GDPR all you like. > and force annoying pop ups on everyone. Pop ups reminding you that all those web sites: 1. Want to track users more than they wanted to avoid annoying users 2. Want to blame the annoying pop-ups on the GDPR instead of, you know, the tracking.

by themgt 4y ago

mort96 4y ago

And they're rather good at it, they seem to be the only major jurisdiction which takes things like privacy seriously.

_heimdall 4y ago
At least when they give themselves the time to be concerned with privacy. They played data privacy extremely fast and loose during Covid response.
data_maan 4y ago
... and it's essential, but thankless work, as the other comments show, since an increase in privacy can't be measured in stock performance, quarterly earnings or GDP - the purely capitalist framework within which too many people (probably including Mr. Graham) think.
- hef19898 4y ago
  Plus, all those regulations make lives harder for whatever companies he invested in.
  - data_maan 4y ago
    I don't want to bash PG, I think it's great that there are people like that. What I don't like is simplistic thinking, where regulation is bad by definition - like he does in his tweet. It can be bad, but it can also be really good if done cleverly. The losses the companies he has invested in sustain duento regulation are not necessarily "absolute losses" in the sense that it is wasted money. The are "societal costs" that need to be payed in order to make sure the companies adhere to a certain level of civility.
    - hef19898 4y ago
      At the very least, good regulations make shared markets like the EU one possible. That the EU has a tendency to over-do it is a different question. But things like the GDPR, REACH and others are actually net wins for society, and as result, the economy.
    - themgt 4y ago
      I don't think the tweet said regulation is bad by definition. The beauty of a simple < 280 chars tweet is that it can contain ambiguity and admit multiple readings. The way I read it is more like if you substituted the EU for say, Saudi Arabia. The Saudis btw bring oil (i.e. energy) to the party - but if they brought nothing but Saudi regulations would you still invite them? What "societal costs" would you be willing to pay to adhere to a certain level of House of Saud defined civility? There's a danger in the myopia of fake universalism, of believing everyone wants your culture and civilization's definition of civility enforced on them - and perhaps they will accommodate you if you're bringing a lot else to the party, but if that's all you're bringing you might simply find yourself uninvited from a lot of parties.
endymi0n 4y ago
It was decried and ridiculed equally at the time, but I doubt the LED revolution would have happened half as fast without the massive artificial demand created by the incandescent bulb ban of the EU. Next Up: Fossils…
- data_maan 4y ago
  For some reason, the EU has a marketing/perception problem, whereas it more than once enacted wise laws that created the right incentives for all players.
boruto 4y ago
The number of cookie banners I get is directly proportional to the amount of privacy EU has.

jevgeni 4y ago

pg has a lot of bad takes

ForRealsies 4y ago
hombre_fatal 4y ago
No he doesn’t. (See how boring these types of comments are?)

ZeroGravitas 4y ago

I'm assuming this is an anti-regulation joke, but it seems unironically a good thing. The EU is pretty good at regulation. and its easier to get the best from US software and Chinese hardware with sensible regulations in place.

sebastialonso 4y ago
Of course it is, it's Paul Graham

kingboss 4y ago

I used to have some sort of small amount of respect for pg when I was much younger. Now I've realised what a libertarian twat he is and how limited and childish his 3 ideas are which he keeps repeating under different guises he calls blog posts.

data_maan 4y ago

The EU enacted the GDPR laws and that had a worldwide positive effect. Yes, GDPR is of course not perfect, but it is much better than the previous status quo. So yes, even though the EU is ridiculed in this joke it actually makes important contributions. Perhaps the only issue is that well-designed regulation is usually so subtle that people don't even recognize the benefits, or take it for granted...

Gud 4y ago
In what way has GDPR been a success? It seems most of what it did was complicate web development and force annoying pop ups on everyone. I'm pretty sure Google etc. still know everything there is to know about me.
- data_maan 4y ago
  The answer to this can be easily found online, so I'll just repeat my earlier ending: "that people don't even recognize the benefits, or take it for granted"
- MattPalmer1086 4y ago
  The whole cookie nonsense is not caused by GDPR at all, it is actually the ePrivacy Directive. GDPR itself only mentions cookies once and only observes that they can be used to profile people. It contains no instructions on what to do about that. The majority of GDPR is a bunch of mostly sensible privacy principles, such as if you manage personal data, you have to look after it well, and not use it for purposes it wasn't collected for.
- teddyh 4y ago
  > most of what it did was complicate web development Only for those wanting to track users. Don’t track users, it’s all good, ignore GDPR all you like. > and force annoying pop ups on everyone. Pop ups reminding you that all those web sites: 1. Want to track users more than they wanted to avoid annoying users 2. Want to blame the annoying pop-ups on the GDPR instead of, you know, the tracking.