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Agreed. If China invaded Taiwan I have no doubts that TSMC and their special ASML machines would become a pile of rubble very quickly. If Taiwan didn’t do it th

by wil421 4y ago

Agreed. If China invaded Taiwan I have no doubts that TSMC and their special ASML machines would become a pile of rubble very quickly. If Taiwan didn’t do it themselves no doubt the US would do it for them.

Gordonjcp 4y ago
> If Taiwan didn’t do it themselves no doubt the US would do it for them. Ah yes, good old American Exceptionalism. Get yourself into another war that you need to get half the western nations to help you get out of again, why don't you?
- LAC-Tech 4y ago
  Just to clarify, we're discussing a scenario where China invades another country and triggers a global economic meltdown, and the jurisdiction you're making snide comments about is... America? America is the nation stopping this happening.
  - roenxi 4y ago
    If the US follows its Ukraine playbook, they'll take a regional challenge and escalate it to a continent wide crisis. Possibly a global crisis if nukes start flying. When the US goes to flatten countries in Asia, the Asian powers politely ignored them. There were some diplomatic protests. The war stayed regional. There is an argument that this is the better approach. There is room here to complain about the US even if they are the main defender of Taiwan. It is good that they are promoting prosperity in Taiwan, but their habit of escalating conflicts could literally get us all killed.
    - LAC-Tech 4y ago
      You're attributing a coherence and unity to US foreign policy that I don't think it has. It can be a stabilizing influence in one part of the world, and destabilizing in another. As to your specific charges "When the US goes to flatten countries in Asia, the Asian powers politely ignored them.", you'll have to be more specific.
      - roenxi 4y ago
        > you'll have to be more specific. Iraq, Afghanistan. Threats against Iran too.
        LAC-Tech 4y ago
        Right, but I think it's reasonably to distinguish between American policy in Taiwan which is to maintain a status quo/peace, and policy in other areas which is... less clear.
        roenxi 4y ago
        It is very easy to differentiate between US foreign policy in Europe and Asia. But if the situation in Asia were to change - say because China invaded Taiwan - it is likely that the US would change their activities too. And if it is anything like their approach in Europe, they'd probably move in and escalate. So in a scenario where China invades another country and triggers a global economic meltdown it is still possible that the US would swoop in and cause the most damage. The Ukraine thing would probably be all over by now if not for the US deciding to set up a proxy war on Russia's borders. I don't think there is any contention on that either, the only argument is whether it was a good idea or not. If the US wasn't involved in Europe, it is likely that there wouldn't be a crisis of the magnitude that is unfolding. When the US invaded numerous middle eastern countries, the Asians pursued policies of de-escalation (realistically, there were no alternatives) and the the crisis stayed relatively contained.
        ceejayoz 4y ago
        > The Ukraine thing would probably be all over by now if not for the US deciding to set up a proxy war on Russia's borders. That's like saying the Iraq War ended in 2003. The death and repression would just be getting started.
  - Gordonjcp 4y ago
    Did you miss the quote at the top? It's important to read all the words.
- phpisthebest 4y ago
  If the US did not do it, I can think of at least 3 other nations that would put them in to a pile. No western nation wants China to forcibly take TSMC. None
zxspectrum1982 4y ago
So what? China will have its own ASML-like machines in a few years. Kiss Taiwan goodbye that day. Truth is China is the new owner of the world. Outsourcing manufacturing, electronics, etc made us too dependent on China and now we are screwed.

by wil421 4y ago

Gordonjcp 4y ago

> If Taiwan didn’t do it themselves no doubt the US would do it for them. Ah yes, good old American Exceptionalism. Get yourself into another war that you need to get half the western nations to help you get out of again, why don't you?

LAC-Tech 4y ago
Just to clarify, we're discussing a scenario where China invades another country and triggers a global economic meltdown, and the jurisdiction you're making snide comments about is... America? America is the nation stopping this happening.
- roenxi 4y ago
  If the US follows its Ukraine playbook, they'll take a regional challenge and escalate it to a continent wide crisis. Possibly a global crisis if nukes start flying. When the US goes to flatten countries in Asia, the Asian powers politely ignored them. There were some diplomatic protests. The war stayed regional. There is an argument that this is the better approach. There is room here to complain about the US even if they are the main defender of Taiwan. It is good that they are promoting prosperity in Taiwan, but their habit of escalating conflicts could literally get us all killed.
  - LAC-Tech 4y ago
    You're attributing a coherence and unity to US foreign policy that I don't think it has. It can be a stabilizing influence in one part of the world, and destabilizing in another. As to your specific charges "When the US goes to flatten countries in Asia, the Asian powers politely ignored them.", you'll have to be more specific.
    - roenxi 4y ago
      > you'll have to be more specific. Iraq, Afghanistan. Threats against Iran too.
      - LAC-Tech 4y ago
        Right, but I think it's reasonably to distinguish between American policy in Taiwan which is to maintain a status quo/peace, and policy in other areas which is... less clear.
        roenxi 4y ago
        It is very easy to differentiate between US foreign policy in Europe and Asia. But if the situation in Asia were to change - say because China invaded Taiwan - it is likely that the US would change their activities too. And if it is anything like their approach in Europe, they'd probably move in and escalate. So in a scenario where China invades another country and triggers a global economic meltdown it is still possible that the US would swoop in and cause the most damage. The Ukraine thing would probably be all over by now if not for the US deciding to set up a proxy war on Russia's borders. I don't think there is any contention on that either, the only argument is whether it was a good idea or not. If the US wasn't involved in Europe, it is likely that there wouldn't be a crisis of the magnitude that is unfolding. When the US invaded numerous middle eastern countries, the Asians pursued policies of de-escalation (realistically, there were no alternatives) and the the crisis stayed relatively contained.
        ceejayoz 4y ago
        > The Ukraine thing would probably be all over by now if not for the US deciding to set up a proxy war on Russia's borders. That's like saying the Iraq War ended in 2003. The death and repression would just be getting started.
- Gordonjcp 4y ago
  Did you miss the quote at the top? It's important to read all the words.
phpisthebest 4y ago
If the US did not do it, I can think of at least 3 other nations that would put them in to a pile. No western nation wants China to forcibly take TSMC. None

zxspectrum1982 4y ago

So what? China will have its own ASML-like machines in a few years. Kiss Taiwan goodbye that day. Truth is China is the new owner of the world. Outsourcing manufacturing, electronics, etc made us too dependent on China and now we are screwed.