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I'm in Philadelphia, PA, USA. It's a convoluted formula based on your type of sewer hookup (https://water.phila.gov/pool/files/rates-and-charges-2022-09-01.pdf

I'm in Philadelphia, PA, USA. It's a convoluted formula based on your type of sewer hookup (https://water.phila.gov/pool/files/rates-and-charges-2022-09-01.pdf https://water.phila.gov/pool/files/rates-and-charges-2022-09...) and there are different tiers of usage, but the initial base rate is $48.96 for the first 1,000 cubic feet of water or 7,480 gallons, so about $0.0065/gallon + sewer cost. A "typical" household in the city (they estimate 500 cubic feet of water usage) is apparently around $70/month total. We typically come in under that at around $60. My gas bill runs about the same in non-winter months, but most of that is the clothes dryer and oven/range. So it's not a negligible amount of money, but it costs less than my combined streaming services. Cutting it by 20% would allow me to afford... another streaming service? A couple of days' groceries? I'm also not sure what kind of showers you're taking, but I know from experience being forced to shower with a mostly-clogged drain for a couple of days there's no way my shower head is filling the tub even over my ankles before the shower is done (5-10 minutes). So "several bath tubs" is an exaggeration unless you're taking extremely long showers or your showerhead has the efficiency of a fire hydrant. And I guess we're just blessed with plentiful water on the US East Coast, because I've lived in several states on this coast for my entire life and I'd never even heard of "Navy Shower" until college, and only then as a reference to... the Navy! Or sometimes we hear about Californians being asked to do so when a drought hits. But whatever, you do you! If it actually does make a difference for you than go for it!

TeMPOraL 4y ago
> So it's not a negligible amount of money, but it costs less than my combined streaming services. Cutting it by 20% would allow me to afford... another streaming service? A couple of days' groceries? Your math comes out similar to what I remember from the utility bill (which I currently don't have handy, so I won't provide exact calculation). It's not life-changing, but it's not nothing. A couple days of groceries worth of money we could use for arbitrary discretionary spending, at a cost of... pretty much nothing, I don't consider this habit to take noticeable effort over keeping the shower running. And with several more such "little to no effort saves you a Netflix subscription" habits, this adds up. You can probably ignore $100-$150 / month saved off utility bills and incidental costs when on a tech-equivalent salary, but many people wouldn't. (And yes, we mind the opportunity costs too.) > I know from experience being forced to shower with a mostly-clogged drain for a couple of days there's no way my shower head is filling the tub even over my ankles before the shower is done (5-10 minutes). That's an interesting data point. I may have exaggerated with "several tubs", though my actual shower, left on for the entire duration and with drain plugged, would fill a tub[0] to the level where, were I to lie down, the water would spill out[1]. We may have different sizes of the tub/showering compartments, and possibly different pressure levels and flow rates. Eyeballing it now, the bathroom faucet gives some 10-12 liters per minute, maybe a bit more; this is cut down to some 8 liters per minute when going through the shower head in default setting. > And I guess we're just blessed with plentiful water on the US East Coast, because I've lived in several states on this coast for my entire life and I'd never even heard of "Navy Shower" until college, and only then as a reference to... the Navy! Or sometimes we hear about Californians being asked to do so when a drought hits. I never heard it called this way until 'stavros mentioned it today! For me, it was always known as the "mom asking 'why are you wasting water in the shower?' shower" :). We don't need to do it, it just feels unnecessarily wasteful if we don't (and it makes noticeable difference in the bills for households on median salary or below). ---- [0] - The 32' x 60' like here: https://www.thespruce.com/bathtub-sizes-reference-guide-1821342 https://www.thespruce.com/bathtub-sizes-reference-guide-1821..., which is similar to "standard bathtub" of 70x170cm where I live. [1] - I admit I got confused by my intuition. A "standard bathtub" similar to [0] will hold over 200 liters of water, which is of course way more than the shower head would provide over the duration of my shower. When I wrote about filling bath tubs, I thought intuitively about the volume past which you can't lie down without it spilling out.
- scottLobster 4y ago
  Well it wouldn't save $100-150 / month, that would be my entire water and gas bill outside of winter. Digging a little deeper, according to the EPA a standard shower head delivers 2.5 gallons/minute (https://www.epa.gov/watersense/showerheads https://www.epa.gov/watersense/showerheads). So over the course of a 10 minute shower that's 25 gallons, * 0.0065/gallon = ~0.16/shower. Sometimes if I'm working from home and not exerting myself physically I won't shower (dry skin so I don't stink after just one day), so say an average 6 showers a week = ~24 showers a month = 3.84, and times 1.5 for the sewer cost (roughly) = $5.76 total / month from the water/sewer usage. Harder to calculate how much water heating costs since the same hot water source goes to all the fixtures/dishwasher/washing machine, and it needs to maintain temperature. But let's be generous and say 20% of the non-winter gas bill is strictly due to heating water for showers. So roughly $14. That's a total of $19.76. Let's say by doing, call them maximum-efficiency showers that take only 1.5 minutes of running water instead of 10. So an 85% reduction in costs would be $16.796 / month in savings. Again not nothing, but I'm not sure it's worth the discomfort either. Plus the steam helps with my shave a couple of days a week. I could also get most of the way there just by taking quicker showers, and honestly I'd rather do that. If I'm going to be uncomfortable, I'd rather have time discomfort than temperature discomfort :) But yeah I guess it's also a cultural thing. And I'm sure there are some families over here that shower that way, I've just never encountered one in conversation/life. You certainly don't see it in gym/school locker room/dorm/pool showers, and in media, as you pointed out, people have the water running constantly.

TeMPOraL 4y ago

> So it's not a negligible amount of money, but it costs less than my combined streaming services. Cutting it by 20% would allow me to afford... another streaming service? A couple of days' groceries? Your math comes out similar to what I remember from the utility bill (which I currently don't have handy, so I won't provide exact calculation). It's not life-changing, but it's not nothing. A couple days of groceries worth of money we could use for arbitrary discretionary spending, at a cost of... pretty much nothing, I don't consider this habit to take noticeable effort over keeping the shower running. And with several more such "little to no effort saves you a Netflix subscription" habits, this adds up. You can probably ignore $100-$150 / month saved off utility bills and incidental costs when on a tech-equivalent salary, but many people wouldn't. (And yes, we mind the opportunity costs too.) > I know from experience being forced to shower with a mostly-clogged drain for a couple of days there's no way my shower head is filling the tub even over my ankles before the shower is done (5-10 minutes). That's an interesting data point. I may have exaggerated with "several tubs", though my actual shower, left on for the entire duration and with drain plugged, would fill a tub[0] to the level where, were I to lie down, the water would spill out[1]. We may have different sizes of the tub/showering compartments, and possibly different pressure levels and flow rates. Eyeballing it now, the bathroom faucet gives some 10-12 liters per minute, maybe a bit more; this is cut down to some 8 liters per minute when going through the shower head in default setting. > And I guess we're just blessed with plentiful water on the US East Coast, because I've lived in several states on this coast for my entire life and I'd never even heard of "Navy Shower" until college, and only then as a reference to... the Navy! Or sometimes we hear about Californians being asked to do so when a drought hits. I never heard it called this way until 'stavros mentioned it today! For me, it was always known as the "mom asking 'why are you wasting water in the shower?' shower" :). We don't need to do it, it just feels unnecessarily wasteful if we don't (and it makes noticeable difference in the bills for households on median salary or below). ---- [0] - The 32' x 60' like here: https://www.thespruce.com/bathtub-sizes-reference-guide-1821342 https://www.thespruce.com/bathtub-sizes-reference-guide-1821..., which is similar to "standard bathtub" of 70x170cm where I live. [1] - I admit I got confused by my intuition. A "standard bathtub" similar to [0] will hold over 200 liters of water, which is of course way more than the shower head would provide over the duration of my shower. When I wrote about filling bath tubs, I thought intuitively about the volume past which you can't lie down without it spilling out.

scottLobster 4y ago
Well it wouldn't save $100-150 / month, that would be my entire water and gas bill outside of winter. Digging a little deeper, according to the EPA a standard shower head delivers 2.5 gallons/minute (https://www.epa.gov/watersense/showerheads https://www.epa.gov/watersense/showerheads). So over the course of a 10 minute shower that's 25 gallons, * 0.0065/gallon = ~0.16/shower. Sometimes if I'm working from home and not exerting myself physically I won't shower (dry skin so I don't stink after just one day), so say an average 6 showers a week = ~24 showers a month = 3.84, and times 1.5 for the sewer cost (roughly) = $5.76 total / month from the water/sewer usage. Harder to calculate how much water heating costs since the same hot water source goes to all the fixtures/dishwasher/washing machine, and it needs to maintain temperature. But let's be generous and say 20% of the non-winter gas bill is strictly due to heating water for showers. So roughly $14. That's a total of $19.76. Let's say by doing, call them maximum-efficiency showers that take only 1.5 minutes of running water instead of 10. So an 85% reduction in costs would be $16.796 / month in savings. Again not nothing, but I'm not sure it's worth the discomfort either. Plus the steam helps with my shave a couple of days a week. I could also get most of the way there just by taking quicker showers, and honestly I'd rather do that. If I'm going to be uncomfortable, I'd rather have time discomfort than temperature discomfort :) But yeah I guess it's also a cultural thing. And I'm sure there are some families over here that shower that way, I've just never encountered one in conversation/life. You certainly don't see it in gym/school locker room/dorm/pool showers, and in media, as you pointed out, people have the water running constantly.