4 ms·

> I can literally dope silicon and make my own chips How so? The best usable homemade transistor project that I’m aware of, consisted of something on the orde

> I can literally dope silicon and make my own chips How so? The best usable homemade transistor project that I’m aware of, consisted of something on the order of 100 amplifiers/transistors on a chip. And even then, the author had access to professionally made silicon wafers, and likely a whole lot of expensive/dangerous chemicals and equipment. This is very far outside the realm of a casual hacker. Making even the simplest 6502 equivalent by yourself is impossible, forget more complex projects. I feel like this should be urgently addressed, given how important computing is.

carapace 4y ago
You got me. That was more of a rhetorical flourish than something I've actually done, or would do. "I haven't done this recently. Or in the past." Sam Zeloof is doing great things: http://sam.zeloof.xyz/ http://sam.zeloof.xyz/ > Making even the simplest 6502 equivalent by yourself is impossible, forget more complex projects. I feel like this should be urgently addressed, given how important computing is. I've thought about this, more in the context of post-apocalyptic computing rather than trust, FWIW. If I were really going to make my own computers from scratch I think clockwork (Clock of the Long Now) or fluidics would probably be the way to go. Maybe electro-mechanical (relays, etc.) or vacuum tubes? We did pretty well with the abacus and the slide rule, eh?
- selfhoster11 4y ago
  Sam Zeloof’s project is the exact one I had in mind when writing my comment. His work is extremely impressive, but it’s almost shameful that for over 40 years (collective) we as hobbyists have not had the ability to manufacture even something as simple as a 4004. May Sam’s work progress, and may we all build on his success. > I've thought about this, more in the context of post-apocalyptic computing rather than trust, FWIW. Post-apocalyptic computing is one possible motivation to look at this, but other reduced-tech settings like a fully independent Mars colony also simply cannot function without a way to fab simple IC logic. That, or we’re happy to go back to early Apollo era tech levels. RE: computers from scratch in the absence of IC fabrication. I think our best chance is vacuum tubes. Mechanical relay computers seem to have been phased out in favour of vacuum tube solutions pretty quickly, so I guess there must have been some compelling reasons to do so (my guess - speed and failure rate of individual switching components). Couple that with old-school electromechanical tech for IO/industrial sequencing, several K of delay line/core/Williams Tube memory, and you’re golden.

carapace 4y ago

You got me. That was more of a rhetorical flourish than something I've actually done, or would do. "I haven't done this recently. Or in the past." Sam Zeloof is doing great things: http://sam.zeloof.xyz/ http://sam.zeloof.xyz/ > Making even the simplest 6502 equivalent by yourself is impossible, forget more complex projects. I feel like this should be urgently addressed, given how important computing is. I've thought about this, more in the context of post-apocalyptic computing rather than trust, FWIW. If I were really going to make my own computers from scratch I think clockwork (Clock of the Long Now) or fluidics would probably be the way to go. Maybe electro-mechanical (relays, etc.) or vacuum tubes? We did pretty well with the abacus and the slide rule, eh?

selfhoster11 4y ago
Sam Zeloof’s project is the exact one I had in mind when writing my comment. His work is extremely impressive, but it’s almost shameful that for over 40 years (collective) we as hobbyists have not had the ability to manufacture even something as simple as a 4004. May Sam’s work progress, and may we all build on his success. > I've thought about this, more in the context of post-apocalyptic computing rather than trust, FWIW. Post-apocalyptic computing is one possible motivation to look at this, but other reduced-tech settings like a fully independent Mars colony also simply cannot function without a way to fab simple IC logic. That, or we’re happy to go back to early Apollo era tech levels. RE: computers from scratch in the absence of IC fabrication. I think our best chance is vacuum tubes. Mechanical relay computers seem to have been phased out in favour of vacuum tube solutions pretty quickly, so I guess there must have been some compelling reasons to do so (my guess - speed and failure rate of individual switching components). Couple that with old-school electromechanical tech for IO/industrial sequencing, several K of delay line/core/Williams Tube memory, and you’re golden.