12 ms·
Although a great game, I’m not sure it can be considered a roguelike.
by jawr 4y ago
Although a great game, I’m not sure it can be considered a roguelike.
- MrLeap 4y agoIt has the procedural generation and permanent death. I'd say it shares many characteristics, enough to be called a cousin at least.
- Sohcahtoa82 4y agoWhen I think of a "roguelike", I think of a game that is played in "runs" where a run is typically 60 minutes or less, but completing a game round is not completing the entire game, as it will take several runs to unlock all the features and content. You are also generally not expected to be able to complete a run to the final boss in your first several attempts. Hades, FTL, Vampire Survivors, Gunfire Reborn, and Crypt of the Necrodancer all satisfy these. RimWorld is not at all a roguelike because a "run" can easily last hundreds of hours.
- djur 4y agoThe classic roguelikes can take many hours to complete and do not have any kind of between-run unlocking. By some common definitions, unlockable content makes a game not a roguelike. I wouldn't go that far, but I'd never call Vampire Survivors a roguelike, either.
- Bakary 4y agoIt's hard to say because the terms end up shifting to mean various things as the genre solidifies. I personally like using roguelite for games such as Hades, in which case the operating features are procedural generation, permadeath, and metaprogress with each run
- qu4z-2 4y agoYou could make a case for the genre "re"solidifying, but roguelikes as a genre were hardly an indistinct vapour before this recent craze.
- ncallaway 4y agoI’ve used roguelite the same way. It’s definitely my preferred model for the space, mostly because I’m bad at games, so the meta progress gives me the feeling of progression without nearly so much work!
- Bakary 4y agoThe design concept is absolutely perfect for working adults. Instead of having a session where you make slow progress on a very long adventure, you get an actual self-contained experience while also making some headway towards a larger goal each time.
- bavell 4y agoI'd also add that "rougelikes" heavily emphasize replayability (at least in my limited experience). FTL and Slay the Spire are probably my top two favs in the genre.
- fknorangesite 4y agoThe strict roguelike fans would argue that these are in fact roguelites, since there is some (small) amount of carryover between runs. The more orthodox view is that every run starts from zero.
- donio 4y agoNone of the games you mention are roguelikes. Crypt of the Necrodancer is closest.
- socialismisok 4y agoI would disagree. As a game dev, I'd argue that if players categorize a game as a roguelike, it's a roguelike. Language is not prescriptive. They may be roguelikes with additional elements, but there's no one true definition of what a roguelike must be. And yes, I'm aware of roguelites. The existence of a more specific piece of jargon does not invalidate the use of the more generic term. Insisting on a narrow, historical use of language serves only the purpose of gatekeeping and pedantic "I know better than you" behaviors.
- mcv 4y agoI don't think most roguelike players would describe those games as roguelikes, though. The quintessential roguelikes are Nethack, Moria, Angband and AdoM. You're a @ fighting monsters represented by other ascii characters, in an environment (usually a dungeon, though AdoM expanded that) represented by ascii characters. Procedurally generated, turn-based, super deadly, very tactical, with an almost infinite amount of stuff you can find, use, or do. Playing all the way through the end is nearly impossible, would take many hours on a single run, but years to learn and master the game to the point that you can actually make it that far in a single run. I can understand adding some graphics to the game (though I'm personally not a fan of that), and AdoM certainly showed how the genre can be stretched from a single dungeon to a landscape with multiple very different dungeons, but the further you move away from this core, the less roguelike the game becomes. Because it simply becomes less like the original game rogue (which nobody seems to have played). I suppose 'roguelite' is a more suitable name for games that take some of the roguelike elements but not all of them, and make it into something completely different.
- socialismisok 4y agoI play roguelikes like Hades. If you asked Hades players "is Hades a roguelike" I think most would say yes. Language evolves. Rogue, Nethack, Angband, etc are now just a type of roguelike.
- lofaszvanitt 4y agoNo one really knows what a roguelike is, yet it is repeated ad infinitum. If the general populace doesn't really know what a roguelike is, why not describe it with proper wording like: mostly shallow content sold as something shiny in a repetitive way, lack of original story/background, time vampire if no proper checkpoint/save system in place. The best egregious example of terrible game design is the game called Returnal where the game designers sentenced the player to recollect most of the items/loot upon failure because who knows why. This isn't a problem in itself if done properly, but why going through the same area again and again, why collect the proper weapon again if you fail at a boss, is just plain stupidity or malignancy. So in essence a childish idiot sentences you to replay his "super creation" multiple times, because he thought that's cool. thank you. you, the gamer, will come into this equation with your most precious resource: time. how do you want to spend your time? by repeating the same BORING shit or progressing and experiencing new, stimulating areas while a story is told to you?
- jiggawatts 4y agoIt's pretty much a Dwarf Fortress clone.
- fknorangesite 4y agoWe need a law akin to Godwin's: if any online discussion continues long enough, someone will almost certainly argue about the definition of "roguelike."