3 ms·

My opinion is: make it correct unless it distracts from the story/gameplay. Most people won't notice but those who do will be happy. On a AAA game, you can affo

by GuB-42 4y ago

My opinion is: make it correct unless it distracts from the story/gameplay. Most people won't notice but those who do will be happy. On a AAA game, you can afford to hire a couple of medievalists and get these details correct. Sometimes, factual errors are actually deliberate in order to improve gameplay. For example, accurate architecture may take a back seat to level design. Weapons may react in completely unrealistic ways, but it is understandable because in real life, people didn't fight with controllers. People go much faster than they should, distances are shortened, there is either too much or too little variety because having too much of the same thing is boring and having variation is every small detail is too expensive. All that is not just excusable, it is actually good design, it is a game, not a history lesson. Sometimes, though it is more relevant in movies, there is a deliberate inaccuracy just because that's what people expect and doing it differently would make the audience focus on an unimportant detail or mess with the pacing. And sometimes, it is just to save money that is better spend elsewhere. I don't think having period accurate pigs is any of these, so for me, it is a mistake, no more, no less. Not the worst, but it deserves a "bug report".

insane_dreamer 4y ago
> Weapons may react in completely unrealistic ways And your character is also likely carrying more of them than their period counterparts, or in some cases, is humanly possible
- marginalia_nu 4y ago
  Most weapons are fairly light. Could easily lug around a diablo inventory of swords in a large sturdy backpack.
  - insane_dreamer 4y ago
    For how long? Over what type of terrain? How would it impact your stamina level? Could you fight with the backpack on? When you set it down to fight, could an opponent steal it?
    - marginalia_nu 4y ago
      A sword can weigh as little as 1 lbs. On average maybe 2-2.5. If the weight is sensibly allocated, that is not something that will significantly bog you down. If it is, you really need cardio.
- anigbrowl 4y ago
  Loadouts in most RPGs are so absurd even with limits. I'm surprised no game (that I know of) capitalizes on this issue by giving you access to stuff but making you stage it strategically, eg leaving ammo along your line of retreat so you can surprise your pursuers. Maybe designers have found that it's too much prep and planning whereas players want action, but then again the From Software * Souls games suggests many players enjoy having to work at it.
  - account42 4y ago
    Most games try really hard to make it impossible to paint yourself into a corner where you have to re-do a large stretch because you messed up. I guess somthing like this would be a great difficulty option - much better than bloated HP enemies.
crtasm 4y ago
> it is a game, not a history lesson In the case of recent Assassins Creed games, it's both. "...freely roam Ancient Greece, Ancient Egypt and the Viking Age to learn more about their history and daily life. Students, teachers, non-gamers, and players can discover these eras at their own pace, or embark on guided tours and stories curated by historians and experts." https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/assassins-creed/discovery-tour https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/assassins-creed/discovery...
- baud147258 4y ago
  Regarding the latest Assassin's Creed, that reminded me of a (long) blog post [0] by a historian, though it deals more in themes than all the historical inaccuracies present in the game. He then did another post on Expeditions: Rome, a game that claimed historical verisimilitude and all the mistakes it made [1]. [0] https://acoup.blog/2020/11/20/miscellanea-my-thoughts-on-assassins-creed-valhalla/ https://acoup.blog/2020/11/20/miscellanea-my-thoughts-on-ass... [1] https://acoup.blog/2022/04/15/collections-expeditions-rome-and-the-perils-of-verisimilitude/ https://acoup.blog/2022/04/15/collections-expeditions-rome-a...
  - MikePlacid 4y ago
    Thank you for the links. From [0]: The first two mission chains in England involve replacing the ‘bad guy’ anti-pagan king of Mercia with a good guy reasonable king Ceolwulf (and his good guy reasonable son) and rescuing the Dane-ruled settlement of Grantebridge where, I kid you not, we are told that this settlement was just a tiny village when the Danes moved in and built it up into a big, multi-cultural trading town and all of the local English folks are just totally OK with this and it is just the mean nasty Saxon army (led by a bad guy member of an evil conspiracy) who are ruining everything. Apparently all of the Danish vikings only really came by for infrastructure week. This problem is infinitely compounded by the way the game treats, or more correctly does not treat, the Norse practice of slavery. This, for me, is a much bigger - history-wise - problem than a color of pigs.
ajmurmann 4y ago
Among things that if done realistic, might take you out of the game experience, I'd also expect dialog. Leaving out how any given vocabulary and pronunciation has radically changed, I'd also expect just the flow of a conversation, what people valued and what they took for granted for things like social hierarchy and everyday customs would be completely alienating. I have no concrete examples, but I am sure that just observing interactions within a family or between a store keeper and a customer would be totally alien to anyone playing a modern video game.
- 0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
  >… what people valued and what they took for granted for things like social hierarchy and everyday customs would be completely alienating One such historical custom which has gone by the wayside: an entire family used to share a single bed. If you had a stranger over, they were likely to hop in as well for the night.
  - mizzao 4y ago
    So, co-sleeping is totally consistent with the Lindy effect!
q-big 4y ago
> On a AAA game, you can afford to hire a couple of medievalists and get these details correct. The financing of AAA titles is actually rather tight; the fact that AAA titles hardly ever do experiments in gameplay and the fact that in many studios crunch time happens show how tight the financial planning of AAA titles has to be to work out.
- kcexn 4y ago
  This is not because the publishers can't afford to spend a bit more. But because they would rather capture every last dollar of profit. There's an argument to be made that getting some of these details right would improve their profitability. For sure people will be talking about the strange pigs wandering around outside the villages.
- 0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
  I would love to know what percentage of that budget has anything to do with development vs advertising. I see ads for games on buses, billboards, tv commercials, etc that do not seem cheap.
  - q-big 4y ago
    See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_games_to_develop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_g... for a list of estimated development and marketing costs for various AAA games.
  - ummonk 4y ago
    A lot of the marketing happens post launch and is thus low risk as you can adjust the budget based on sales performance. The same isn’t true for game development itself, which must be limited to a fixed budget based on anticipated future sales.

by GuB-42 4y ago

insane_dreamer 4y ago

> Weapons may react in completely unrealistic ways And your character is also likely carrying more of them than their period counterparts, or in some cases, is humanly possible

marginalia_nu 4y ago
Most weapons are fairly light. Could easily lug around a diablo inventory of swords in a large sturdy backpack.
- insane_dreamer 4y ago
  For how long? Over what type of terrain? How would it impact your stamina level? Could you fight with the backpack on? When you set it down to fight, could an opponent steal it?
  - marginalia_nu 4y ago
    A sword can weigh as little as 1 lbs. On average maybe 2-2.5. If the weight is sensibly allocated, that is not something that will significantly bog you down. If it is, you really need cardio.
anigbrowl 4y ago
Loadouts in most RPGs are so absurd even with limits. I'm surprised no game (that I know of) capitalizes on this issue by giving you access to stuff but making you stage it strategically, eg leaving ammo along your line of retreat so you can surprise your pursuers. Maybe designers have found that it's too much prep and planning whereas players want action, but then again the From Software * Souls games suggests many players enjoy having to work at it.
- account42 4y ago
  Most games try really hard to make it impossible to paint yourself into a corner where you have to re-do a large stretch because you messed up. I guess somthing like this would be a great difficulty option - much better than bloated HP enemies.

crtasm 4y ago

> it is a game, not a history lesson In the case of recent Assassins Creed games, it's both. "...freely roam Ancient Greece, Ancient Egypt and the Viking Age to learn more about their history and daily life. Students, teachers, non-gamers, and players can discover these eras at their own pace, or embark on guided tours and stories curated by historians and experts." https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/assassins-creed/discovery-tour https://www.ubisoft.com/en-us/game/assassins-creed/discovery...

baud147258 4y ago
Regarding the latest Assassin's Creed, that reminded me of a (long) blog post [0] by a historian, though it deals more in themes than all the historical inaccuracies present in the game. He then did another post on Expeditions: Rome, a game that claimed historical verisimilitude and all the mistakes it made [1]. [0] https://acoup.blog/2020/11/20/miscellanea-my-thoughts-on-assassins-creed-valhalla/ https://acoup.blog/2020/11/20/miscellanea-my-thoughts-on-ass... [1] https://acoup.blog/2022/04/15/collections-expeditions-rome-and-the-perils-of-verisimilitude/ https://acoup.blog/2022/04/15/collections-expeditions-rome-a...
- MikePlacid 4y ago
  Thank you for the links. From [0]: The first two mission chains in England involve replacing the ‘bad guy’ anti-pagan king of Mercia with a good guy reasonable king Ceolwulf (and his good guy reasonable son) and rescuing the Dane-ruled settlement of Grantebridge where, I kid you not, we are told that this settlement was just a tiny village when the Danes moved in and built it up into a big, multi-cultural trading town and all of the local English folks are just totally OK with this and it is just the mean nasty Saxon army (led by a bad guy member of an evil conspiracy) who are ruining everything. Apparently all of the Danish vikings only really came by for infrastructure week. This problem is infinitely compounded by the way the game treats, or more correctly does not treat, the Norse practice of slavery. This, for me, is a much bigger - history-wise - problem than a color of pigs.

ajmurmann 4y ago

Among things that if done realistic, might take you out of the game experience, I'd also expect dialog. Leaving out how any given vocabulary and pronunciation has radically changed, I'd also expect just the flow of a conversation, what people valued and what they took for granted for things like social hierarchy and everyday customs would be completely alienating. I have no concrete examples, but I am sure that just observing interactions within a family or between a store keeper and a customer would be totally alien to anyone playing a modern video game.

0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
>… what people valued and what they took for granted for things like social hierarchy and everyday customs would be completely alienating One such historical custom which has gone by the wayside: an entire family used to share a single bed. If you had a stranger over, they were likely to hop in as well for the night.
- mizzao 4y ago
  So, co-sleeping is totally consistent with the Lindy effect!

q-big 4y ago

> On a AAA game, you can afford to hire a couple of medievalists and get these details correct. The financing of AAA titles is actually rather tight; the fact that AAA titles hardly ever do experiments in gameplay and the fact that in many studios crunch time happens show how tight the financial planning of AAA titles has to be to work out.

kcexn 4y ago
This is not because the publishers can't afford to spend a bit more. But because they would rather capture every last dollar of profit. There's an argument to be made that getting some of these details right would improve their profitability. For sure people will be talking about the strange pigs wandering around outside the villages.
0cf8612b2e1e 4y ago
I would love to know what percentage of that budget has anything to do with development vs advertising. I see ads for games on buses, billboards, tv commercials, etc that do not seem cheap.
- q-big 4y ago
  See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_games_to_develop https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_most_expensive_video_g... for a list of estimated development and marketing costs for various AAA games.
- ummonk 4y ago
  A lot of the marketing happens post launch and is thus low risk as you can adjust the budget based on sales performance. The same isn’t true for game development itself, which must be limited to a fixed budget based on anticipated future sales.