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WFH coincides with rapidly rising interest in urbanist views(the "Not Just Bikes" and "Strong Towns" crowd). The previous US era's low trust ceded all ground to

WFH coincides with rapidly rising interest in urbanist views(the "Not Just Bikes" and "Strong Towns" crowd). The previous US era's low trust ceded all ground to private spaces: if you went out, it was to work, to buy something, or to participate in some structured activity like exercise. The "town squares" to idle in disappeared, hence workplaces became very central to people's lives as the only kind of commons. And the public roads defined themselves around automobile traffic, another way of making a private space, or at least the illusion of such. The previous generations accepted this as the terms of the good life; near-total control over the private domain, even where it came with negative externalities. This is the thing that is now being questioned, because for younger generations, there has been little opportunity to "get on the property ladder". They have been crowded into working from home with four roommates. When they go online, it is mediated by surveillance at every turn. And it costs too much now to go for long drives by car. Their private space sucks! As I see it, the energy of the youth is gradually being sapped away from political movements made on private terms - blaming an other to justify further division of public space - towards the idea of revitalizing the commons, an idea which has a kind of inevitability behind it coming from this low point, since it satisfies a huge diversity of needs. Remaking the public space is, in fact, stunningly easy: close a few roads in urban centers, near destinations, to auto traffic, and put out some seating. Times Square did this; JFK Drive as well. Both are transformed places. When the cars are cleared out and you have "eyes on the street", the perceptions of cities as fundamentally anonymous places disappear, as well. This only becomes more true as alternate modes of mobility are introduced; the huge uptake of ebikes nationwide has exceeded every expectation and has created a flywheel of demand for more urban bike infrastructure, and therefore more public space.

Mountain_Skies 4y ago
That only works if you're willing to be ruthless is cracking down on unapproved behaviors and activities. Most public spaces weren't destroyed by automobiles, they were destroyed by humans produced by contemporary society. A drunk masturbating in front of children in the park isn't caused by a lack of ebikes.
- nicbou 4y ago
  We must live in very different places. I patronise the public spaces everywhere I go, and what you describe is highly atypical. Unless of course you treat public spaces like Americans treat buses. If it becomes a miserable experience only the destitute would use, those who can will avoid it, and those who can't will perpetuate it. But where I live everyone uses public spaces. The wealthy don't retreat to private backyards.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- bluedino 4y ago
  Our public parks went downhill. People park cars on the grass, do donuts in the grass, race through the park. People drink alcohol and smoke marijuana in the park, leave their trash all over, play obnoxiously loud music...
majormajor 4y ago
There's a lot of chatter in certain internet circles about those ideas... But in practice, the leave-it-at-the-door delivery-or-no-touch-pickup world is not one I'd describe as higher trust and more social. Times Square? Other similar "close a few roads and have a mall" places? There's nothing there revitalizing socialization compared to the previous generation of indoor malls.
- nicbou 4y ago
  If Times Square is the only public space you can think of, you're either unimaginative or arguing in bad faith. Try Central Park maybe? I have an axe to grind about interaction-free delivery services, but it's a different debate. Public spaces are for when you intend to see other people. Public spaces as I've experienced them are much better than malls. For one thing they're outside. It's not easy to be outside for many city dwellers. They're also a place where you're not expected to spend money. You can bring your own food, drinks and entertainment. You can do nothing at all and not be perceived as a threat. You aren't screaming over the noise of car traffic. The silence is a revelation when you experience it for the first time. I spent my summer in public spaces. I miss them dearly when I travel to concrete jungles and sleepy suburbias.
- RC_ITR 4y ago
  > But in practice, the leave-it-at-the-door delivery-or-no-touch-pickup world is not one I'd describe as higher trust and more social. You’re making the point for them. Interaction with service providers shouldn’t be a primary social outlet for people (as much for the sake of the service provider as the customer); previous generations’ choices just made it one of the most important outlets since it’s one of the most convenient, especially if you’re willing to pay for it (they major driver of almost all 20th century social trends). Even happenstance “excuse me, pardon me” type small talk to peers is worlds better than a forced corporate smile from a waiter who relies on tips to survive, because at least then, you’re forced to have some amount of empathy/introspection (since the other party isn’t being paid to be nice). The rub of this, though, is then plenty of people only like to interact with service providers (especially as they get older) and this new world can feel isolating to them, but I don’t think that’s a measure of Gen Z or whatever’s commitment to civic socialization.
nicbou 4y ago
We are blessed with a lot of public spaces in Berlin. Not just squares but also parks, lakes and bike paths in nature. This is where we met all summer. Grilling in the park, cycling around, swimming in lakes etc. You meet your friends and their friends too. You bring your dates there. You have hard conversations there. You play sports together there. It's not just about socialisation. It's a place where you can be not-home. You don't have to eat or drink alcohol or pay. You can just linger there and be left alone. Public spaces are so incredibly important, but I don't imagine the political class as people who go to parks a lot.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- ChuckNorris89 4y ago
  >We are blessed with a lot of public spaces in Berlin. And cursed with a terrible housing market, especially for newcomers. >Public spaces are so incredibly important, but I don't imagine the political class as people who go to parks a lot. So much this on both fronts. In many countries, like Austria and others I'm sure, the political class really has neglected public spaces that aren't for tourists, as they're not the users of it. Public parks have mostly been relegated as places for the "poor" and "working class" to hang out who can't afford a house in the green suburbs with a nice big garden surrounded by forests. Which is ironic since the rich kids are always driving their cars from their suburbs to the parks downtown to hang out as that's where the best parties are. :)
  - vanderZwan 4y ago
    > And cursed with a terrible housing market, especially for newcomers. That isn't exactly unique to Berlin you know. And IIRC at least the local government tried to do something about it (but was struck down in higher courts).
    - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
      >the local government tried to do something about it (but was struck down in higher courts). What the local government tried to do was freeze the rents which only made the situation worse, not better.
rayiner 4y ago
Has there been an increase in urbanist views? In the US, big cities saw huge population losses in the last couple of years: https://www.brookings.edu/research/big-cities-saw-historic-population-losses-while-suburban-growth-declined-during-the-pandemic/ https://www.brookings.edu/research/big-cities-saw-historic-p... And the cities that kept growing are places that are not urbanist at all: Phoenix, Fort Worth, etc.

Mountain_Skies 4y ago

That only works if you're willing to be ruthless is cracking down on unapproved behaviors and activities. Most public spaces weren't destroyed by automobiles, they were destroyed by humans produced by contemporary society. A drunk masturbating in front of children in the park isn't caused by a lack of ebikes.

nicbou 4y ago
We must live in very different places. I patronise the public spaces everywhere I go, and what you describe is highly atypical. Unless of course you treat public spaces like Americans treat buses. If it becomes a miserable experience only the destitute would use, those who can will avoid it, and those who can't will perpetuate it. But where I live everyone uses public spaces. The wealthy don't retreat to private backyards.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
bluedino 4y ago
Our public parks went downhill. People park cars on the grass, do donuts in the grass, race through the park. People drink alcohol and smoke marijuana in the park, leave their trash all over, play obnoxiously loud music...

majormajor 4y ago

There's a lot of chatter in certain internet circles about those ideas... But in practice, the leave-it-at-the-door delivery-or-no-touch-pickup world is not one I'd describe as higher trust and more social. Times Square? Other similar "close a few roads and have a mall" places? There's nothing there revitalizing socialization compared to the previous generation of indoor malls.

nicbou 4y ago
If Times Square is the only public space you can think of, you're either unimaginative or arguing in bad faith. Try Central Park maybe? I have an axe to grind about interaction-free delivery services, but it's a different debate. Public spaces are for when you intend to see other people. Public spaces as I've experienced them are much better than malls. For one thing they're outside. It's not easy to be outside for many city dwellers. They're also a place where you're not expected to spend money. You can bring your own food, drinks and entertainment. You can do nothing at all and not be perceived as a threat. You aren't screaming over the noise of car traffic. The silence is a revelation when you experience it for the first time. I spent my summer in public spaces. I miss them dearly when I travel to concrete jungles and sleepy suburbias.
RC_ITR 4y ago
> But in practice, the leave-it-at-the-door delivery-or-no-touch-pickup world is not one I'd describe as higher trust and more social. You’re making the point for them. Interaction with service providers shouldn’t be a primary social outlet for people (as much for the sake of the service provider as the customer); previous generations’ choices just made it one of the most important outlets since it’s one of the most convenient, especially if you’re willing to pay for it (they major driver of almost all 20th century social trends). Even happenstance “excuse me, pardon me” type small talk to peers is worlds better than a forced corporate smile from a waiter who relies on tips to survive, because at least then, you’re forced to have some amount of empathy/introspection (since the other party isn’t being paid to be nice). The rub of this, though, is then plenty of people only like to interact with service providers (especially as they get older) and this new world can feel isolating to them, but I don’t think that’s a measure of Gen Z or whatever’s commitment to civic socialization.

nicbou 4y ago

We are blessed with a lot of public spaces in Berlin. Not just squares but also parks, lakes and bike paths in nature. This is where we met all summer. Grilling in the park, cycling around, swimming in lakes etc. You meet your friends and their friends too. You bring your dates there. You have hard conversations there. You play sports together there. It's not just about socialisation. It's a place where you can be not-home. You don't have to eat or drink alcohol or pay. You can just linger there and be left alone. Public spaces are so incredibly important, but I don't imagine the political class as people who go to parks a lot.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
ChuckNorris89 4y ago
>We are blessed with a lot of public spaces in Berlin. And cursed with a terrible housing market, especially for newcomers. >Public spaces are so incredibly important, but I don't imagine the political class as people who go to parks a lot. So much this on both fronts. In many countries, like Austria and others I'm sure, the political class really has neglected public spaces that aren't for tourists, as they're not the users of it. Public parks have mostly been relegated as places for the "poor" and "working class" to hang out who can't afford a house in the green suburbs with a nice big garden surrounded by forests. Which is ironic since the rich kids are always driving their cars from their suburbs to the parks downtown to hang out as that's where the best parties are. :)
- vanderZwan 4y ago
  > And cursed with a terrible housing market, especially for newcomers. That isn't exactly unique to Berlin you know. And IIRC at least the local government tried to do something about it (but was struck down in higher courts).
  - ChuckNorris89 4y ago
    >the local government tried to do something about it (but was struck down in higher courts). What the local government tried to do was freeze the rents which only made the situation worse, not better.

rayiner 4y ago

Has there been an increase in urbanist views? In the US, big cities saw huge population losses in the last couple of years: https://www.brookings.edu/research/big-cities-saw-historic-population-losses-while-suburban-growth-declined-during-the-pandemic/ https://www.brookings.edu/research/big-cities-saw-historic-p... And the cities that kept growing are places that are not urbanist at all: Phoenix, Fort Worth, etc.