4 ms·

To ask a naive question: What is it about the flu & covid that require annual boosters? Is it just the prevalence of it creating different variants at a highe

by chrsig 4y ago

To ask a naive question: What is it about the flu & covid that require annual boosters? Is it just the prevalence of it creating different variants at a higher rate than other viruses? Is there a reason beyond cash incentive?

smt88 4y ago
> Is it just the prevalence of it creating different variants at a higher rate than other viruses? Yes. Mutation is also driven partly by infection rates, so a virus that mutates slowly and infects 1 billion people is going to produce dangerous new strains more rapidly than a virus that mutates quickly and infects 100 people. > Is there a reason beyond cash incentive? Yes. Flu vaccines targeted at emerging strains are much, much more effective. "This year's" flu vaccine is never 100% effective on any strain (which is true of all vaccines), but there's a huge difference between a vaccine that's 80% effective for the majority of flu infections vs. a vaccine that's 20% effective.
- landemva 4y ago
  Consider the individual's risk profile (such as age, obesity, etc.) and consider the risks of the medical treatment. All medical treatments have side effects and risks. For a typical child, there is no benefit to a yearly Covid shot, though a yearly flu shot may be worthwhile. In consultation with my Dr., I get neither of these.
  - barbazoo 4y ago
    > For a typical child, there is no benefit to a yearly Covid shot What makes you come to that conclusion?
    - retinaros 4y ago
      the fact that it is banned in some countries like danemark that you know gets the top spot in worldwide healthcare. but you can trust a company that had to pay billions for lying instead.
      - barbazoo 4y ago
        Not a ban: https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-denmark-idUSL1N2ZS0J8 https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-denmar... Also, what about the dozens of developed countries, many of which in the EU with good health care, that do offer vaccines for children?
        retinaros 4y ago
        you are linking an article that just states what I wrote. being a journalist is more and more misleading nowadays. they could be replaced by bots we wouldnt see a difference. « From 1 July, 2022, it will no longer be possible for children and youngsters under the age of 18 to receive the 1st jab, and from 1 September, 2022, it will no longer be possible to receive the 2nd jab,” the Danish Health Authority said. The change was because children and young people rarely suffer severe outcomes of the Omicron variant, it said. » that is what a ban is. NO LONGER POSSIBLE.
        smt88 4y ago
        > that is what a ban is. NO LONGER POSSIBLE. You should have kept reading. > "The authority said that some children with an increased risk would still be eligible for vaccination, after an assessment from a doctor." So that is not what a ban is. It's still possible for children to get vaccines, and this decision by Denmark isn't proof that it's a bad idea for children to get vaccines or that it's a bad idea for adults to get vaccines. When you have to grasp at straws like this, doesn't it sometimes feel like maybe (just maybe) it's time to change your mind about this thing that the vast majority of experts disagree with you on?
        weesh 4y ago
        denmark's view is completely rational. high risk kids get the vaccine. low risk kids who will be fine don't have to get it. america is trying to push this stuff into schools and into your mind so Pfizer can make an absolute killing.
    - landemva 4y ago
      Not my conclusion. This study says "no effect on overall mortality". https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4072489 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4072489 Be alert when reading the literature, because PCR tests don't prove infection. The PCR test amplifies genetic fragments. Every medical treatment has risks which should be considered for each patient.
      - smt88 4y ago
        > This study says "no effect on overall mortality". This would be convincing if mortality were the only measure that mattered, but it isn't. Covid can cause brain, lung, and heart problems that will haunt children for the rest of their lives. We already know that it can cause problems in those organs for months[1]. We also know that long after adults recover from Covid, their risk of all-cause mortality is increased[2]. If vaccines don't increase mortality, then preventing the illness is an extremely compelling reason to recommend it to all children. 1. https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/long-covid-in-kids https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/long-covid-in-kids 2. https://ufhealth.org/news/2022/uf-study-post-covid-mortality-risk-may-be-caused-effects-high-inflammation-during-illness https://ufhealth.org/news/2022/uf-study-post-covid-mortality...
        landemva 4y ago
        The Reuters article quoted below says children rarely suffer severe outcomes from Covid. Why should a healthy child take the risk of this emergency authorization medical treatment when children are generally okay?
        smt88 4y ago
        Because, as I mentioned in my reply, many children survive Covid and still have significant negative effects that lost long after the infection clears up. Immune system battles are extremely hard on the body.
        landemva 4y ago

by chrsig 4y ago

smt88 4y ago

> Is it just the prevalence of it creating different variants at a higher rate than other viruses? Yes. Mutation is also driven partly by infection rates, so a virus that mutates slowly and infects 1 billion people is going to produce dangerous new strains more rapidly than a virus that mutates quickly and infects 100 people. > Is there a reason beyond cash incentive? Yes. Flu vaccines targeted at emerging strains are much, much more effective. "This year's" flu vaccine is never 100% effective on any strain (which is true of all vaccines), but there's a huge difference between a vaccine that's 80% effective for the majority of flu infections vs. a vaccine that's 20% effective.

landemva 4y ago
Consider the individual's risk profile (such as age, obesity, etc.) and consider the risks of the medical treatment. All medical treatments have side effects and risks. For a typical child, there is no benefit to a yearly Covid shot, though a yearly flu shot may be worthwhile. In consultation with my Dr., I get neither of these.
- barbazoo 4y ago
  > For a typical child, there is no benefit to a yearly Covid shot What makes you come to that conclusion?
  - retinaros 4y ago
    the fact that it is banned in some countries like danemark that you know gets the top spot in worldwide healthcare. but you can trust a company that had to pay billions for lying instead.
    - barbazoo 4y ago
      Not a ban: https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-denmark-idUSL1N2ZS0J8 https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-coronavirus-denmar... Also, what about the dozens of developed countries, many of which in the EU with good health care, that do offer vaccines for children?
      - retinaros 4y ago
        you are linking an article that just states what I wrote. being a journalist is more and more misleading nowadays. they could be replaced by bots we wouldnt see a difference. « From 1 July, 2022, it will no longer be possible for children and youngsters under the age of 18 to receive the 1st jab, and from 1 September, 2022, it will no longer be possible to receive the 2nd jab,” the Danish Health Authority said. The change was because children and young people rarely suffer severe outcomes of the Omicron variant, it said. » that is what a ban is. NO LONGER POSSIBLE.
        smt88 4y ago
        > that is what a ban is. NO LONGER POSSIBLE. You should have kept reading. > "The authority said that some children with an increased risk would still be eligible for vaccination, after an assessment from a doctor." So that is not what a ban is. It's still possible for children to get vaccines, and this decision by Denmark isn't proof that it's a bad idea for children to get vaccines or that it's a bad idea for adults to get vaccines. When you have to grasp at straws like this, doesn't it sometimes feel like maybe (just maybe) it's time to change your mind about this thing that the vast majority of experts disagree with you on?
        weesh 4y ago
        denmark's view is completely rational. high risk kids get the vaccine. low risk kids who will be fine don't have to get it. america is trying to push this stuff into schools and into your mind so Pfizer can make an absolute killing.
  - landemva 4y ago
    Not my conclusion. This study says "no effect on overall mortality". https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4072489 https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4072489 Be alert when reading the literature, because PCR tests don't prove infection. The PCR test amplifies genetic fragments. Every medical treatment has risks which should be considered for each patient.
    - smt88 4y ago
      > This study says "no effect on overall mortality". This would be convincing if mortality were the only measure that mattered, but it isn't. Covid can cause brain, lung, and heart problems that will haunt children for the rest of their lives. We already know that it can cause problems in those organs for months[1]. We also know that long after adults recover from Covid, their risk of all-cause mortality is increased[2]. If vaccines don't increase mortality, then preventing the illness is an extremely compelling reason to recommend it to all children. 1. https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/long-covid-in-kids https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/long-covid-in-kids 2. https://ufhealth.org/news/2022/uf-study-post-covid-mortality-risk-may-be-caused-effects-high-inflammation-during-illness https://ufhealth.org/news/2022/uf-study-post-covid-mortality...
      - landemva 4y ago
        The Reuters article quoted below says children rarely suffer severe outcomes from Covid. Why should a healthy child take the risk of this emergency authorization medical treatment when children are generally okay?
        smt88 4y ago
        Because, as I mentioned in my reply, many children survive Covid and still have significant negative effects that lost long after the infection clears up. Immune system battles are extremely hard on the body.
        landemva 4y ago