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Do you mean the legal definition of harassment, or just the colloquial one? If the legal one, then use the legal system to stop it instead of vigilantism. If ju

Do you mean the legal definition of harassment, or just the colloquial one? If the legal one, then use the legal system to stop it instead of vigilantism. If just the colloquial one, then it is a free speech issue.

d_e_solomon 4y ago
dreen 4y ago
If I think my customer is using my service to harass people do I need to sue them? Or can I just refuse business? It's not the same as refusing to make a gay cake either, because you can't discriminate based on someone being an asshole.
- lbruno 4y ago
  it's the other way around, you can discriminate against arseholes there's specific prohibitions against discrimination on the basis of certain categories
sascha_sl 4y ago
Do you think legal processes can be flawed?
- josephcsible 4y ago
  Yes, but when they are, we should just fix them, rather than resorting to vigilantism.
  - sascha_sl 4y ago
    One could argue that a great many things have been left up for corporations to decide, especially in the US. That is by design. I would of course also love to see this addressed in legislature, but that seems unlikely given the current political climate.
  - haswell 4y ago
    > rather than resorting to vigilantism Where/how is vigilantism occurring?
    - immibis 4y ago
      Kiwifarms users are engaging in vigilantism against their targets, and it's not even vigilantism for a real crime - it's vigilantism for the "crime" of being transgender.
      - haswell 4y ago
        I believe the parent comment was implying vigilantism on the part of ISPs/providers for the actions they’ve taken against KF. I agree that the participants there are engaging in something closer to vigilantism, although I don’t think they actually believe they have a righteous cause, they’re just unabashedly intolerant and enjoy harassing people which is something else.
      - JYellensFuckboy 4y ago
        This isn't quite accurate. While they do disproportionately make threads about people who are trans, they have plenty of threads about cis people as well. It's not like they target random transgender people. If anything, the "crime" would be being Internet-famous.
        Akronymus 4y ago
        And many of the things they post is about immoral/illegal actions. You don't really become a target for them for being well behaved.
    - sonoriyuu 4y ago
      It's vigilantism in the sense that people are trying to take down their service on every possible layer (in this case: peering/infrastructure) but no one is willing to make a legal case against them.
      - 4y ago
Shawnj2 4y ago
Cloudflare isn't required to host your site because you pay them money. Unless that changes, I don't see how they're in the wrong here.

d_e_solomon 4y ago

dreen 4y ago

If I think my customer is using my service to harass people do I need to sue them? Or can I just refuse business? It's not the same as refusing to make a gay cake either, because you can't discriminate based on someone being an asshole.

lbruno 4y ago
it's the other way around, you can discriminate against arseholes there's specific prohibitions against discrimination on the basis of certain categories

sascha_sl 4y ago

Do you think legal processes can be flawed?

josephcsible 4y ago
Yes, but when they are, we should just fix them, rather than resorting to vigilantism.
- sascha_sl 4y ago
  One could argue that a great many things have been left up for corporations to decide, especially in the US. That is by design. I would of course also love to see this addressed in legislature, but that seems unlikely given the current political climate.
- haswell 4y ago
  > rather than resorting to vigilantism Where/how is vigilantism occurring?
  - immibis 4y ago
    Kiwifarms users are engaging in vigilantism against their targets, and it's not even vigilantism for a real crime - it's vigilantism for the "crime" of being transgender.
    - haswell 4y ago
      I believe the parent comment was implying vigilantism on the part of ISPs/providers for the actions they’ve taken against KF. I agree that the participants there are engaging in something closer to vigilantism, although I don’t think they actually believe they have a righteous cause, they’re just unabashedly intolerant and enjoy harassing people which is something else.
    - JYellensFuckboy 4y ago
      This isn't quite accurate. While they do disproportionately make threads about people who are trans, they have plenty of threads about cis people as well. It's not like they target random transgender people. If anything, the "crime" would be being Internet-famous.
      - Akronymus 4y ago
        And many of the things they post is about immoral/illegal actions. You don't really become a target for them for being well behaved.
  - sonoriyuu 4y ago
    It's vigilantism in the sense that people are trying to take down their service on every possible layer (in this case: peering/infrastructure) but no one is willing to make a legal case against them.
    - 4y ago

Shawnj2 4y ago

Cloudflare isn't required to host your site because you pay them money. Unless that changes, I don't see how they're in the wrong here.