4 ms·

I feel like the remote work folks might be unintentionally throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Yes, I believe people should do what they want but I also

by gernb 4y ago

I feel like the remote work folks might be unintentionally throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Yes, I believe people should do what they want but I also believe decisions can have unintended consequences. Tons of people make friends at work. I'm pretty confident, if we stop going to work we, collectively, won't make many friends via work. I go to work 3 days a week as requested by my company but others don't so about 1-2 of 6 days I show up and no one else on my team is there. There is arguably an issue with people having less friends than ever https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/07/well/live/adult-friendships-number.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/07/well/live/adult-friendshi... https://nypost.com/2021/07/27/americans-have-fewer-friends-than-ever-before-study/ https://nypost.com/2021/07/27/americans-have-fewer-friends-t... People will reply they don't want friends from work but that doesn't change the fact that lots of people make friends at work, people have less friends than ever, and working from home will only lower that number even more. This was posted yesterday: https://ncase.me/trust/ https://ncase.me/trust/ It was basically saying society doesn't function without a majority of people having trusting relationships. Well, less gathering because WFH arguably means less friends made in aggregate means less trusting relationships, means downward spiral for society. WFH isn't the reason we got to this low friendship point but it will pretty obviously add to the problem. I'll go even further, do the WFH arguments apply just was well to Learn From Home (LFH). Why should students have to commute to a school or collage, they can just do it all remote. It feels like all the same arguments apply. Similarly, people can claim why should they be forced to be with fellow students the same way WFH advocates say they don't want friends from work, why would that be different for friends from school? And yet, people form lasting relationships from school friends, both high school and college. In fact most people arguably find most of their close life long friends in those years. But applying the same logic as WFH advocates we should allow LFH and I think if we did we'd end up with the same unintended consequences.

BlargMcLarg 4y ago
>Well, less gathering because WFH arguably means less friends made in aggregate means less trusting relationships, means downward spiral for society. This is a false equivalency. You don't need to be friends to have a basic sense of trust that people won't stab you in the back or be out to get you. >And yet, people form lasting relationships from school friends, both high school and college. There are two very big differences you don't give any credence to. Kids are still growing and put with their peers. Comparatively, adults are far more rigid, have already traversed most of their social lives and many are not among their peers in anything except a commonly practiced discipline. Sharing a discipline isn't a net gain by default, either. Regardless, it doesn't really matter. You don't need to forcefeed people one way of working like we've done for the past decades, for one. For two, most of your arguments towards adults are moot considering work friends aren't solving the problems most people have regarding lack of friends, quality time, love and romance, and more. Trying to pine this on WFH is pointing at the red herring.
- gernb 4y ago
  > >Well, less gathering because WFH arguably means less friends made in aggregate means less trusting relationships, means downward spiral for society. > This is a false equivalency. You don't need to be friends to have a basic sense of trust that people won't stab you in the back or be out to get you. That is not what the point of that article was. The point of that article was that unless people are close they'll assume when they get wronged that there was ill intent even if there wasn't. To put it another way, you forgive your friends but not your non-friends. > Regardless, it doesn't really matter. You don't need to forcefeed people one way of working like we've done for the past decades, for one. For two, most of your arguments towards adults are moot considering work friends aren't solving the problems most people have regarding lack of friends, quality time, love and romance, and more. Trying to pine this on WFH is pointing at the red herring. There's a practically unlimited amount of evidence that people make strong and lasting friends at work. Removing that is removing a large source of making friends throughout life. Further, you mentioned love and romance, well, work is in the top 2 of places that people meet their spouse through work. Switch from spouse to lover and the number skyrockets. Remove that and that source of love and romance disappears. https://yougov.co.uk/topics/society/articles-reports/2020/02/13/how-do-brits-find-love https://yougov.co.uk/topics/society/articles-reports/2020/02... Dating app are popular now but they only work for people who present well. For the rest, many fall for people they spend lots of time getting to know. Work is the #1 source of a place where people spend time together and so a chance to get to know someone beyond a picture and a paragraph of text.

by gernb 4y ago

BlargMcLarg 4y ago

>Well, less gathering because WFH arguably means less friends made in aggregate means less trusting relationships, means downward spiral for society. This is a false equivalency. You don't need to be friends to have a basic sense of trust that people won't stab you in the back or be out to get you. >And yet, people form lasting relationships from school friends, both high school and college. There are two very big differences you don't give any credence to. Kids are still growing and put with their peers. Comparatively, adults are far more rigid, have already traversed most of their social lives and many are not among their peers in anything except a commonly practiced discipline. Sharing a discipline isn't a net gain by default, either. Regardless, it doesn't really matter. You don't need to forcefeed people one way of working like we've done for the past decades, for one. For two, most of your arguments towards adults are moot considering work friends aren't solving the problems most people have regarding lack of friends, quality time, love and romance, and more. Trying to pine this on WFH is pointing at the red herring.

gernb 4y ago
> >Well, less gathering because WFH arguably means less friends made in aggregate means less trusting relationships, means downward spiral for society. > This is a false equivalency. You don't need to be friends to have a basic sense of trust that people won't stab you in the back or be out to get you. That is not what the point of that article was. The point of that article was that unless people are close they'll assume when they get wronged that there was ill intent even if there wasn't. To put it another way, you forgive your friends but not your non-friends. > Regardless, it doesn't really matter. You don't need to forcefeed people one way of working like we've done for the past decades, for one. For two, most of your arguments towards adults are moot considering work friends aren't solving the problems most people have regarding lack of friends, quality time, love and romance, and more. Trying to pine this on WFH is pointing at the red herring. There's a practically unlimited amount of evidence that people make strong and lasting friends at work. Removing that is removing a large source of making friends throughout life. Further, you mentioned love and romance, well, work is in the top 2 of places that people meet their spouse through work. Switch from spouse to lover and the number skyrockets. Remove that and that source of love and romance disappears. https://yougov.co.uk/topics/society/articles-reports/2020/02/13/how-do-brits-find-love https://yougov.co.uk/topics/society/articles-reports/2020/02... Dating app are popular now but they only work for people who present well. For the rest, many fall for people they spend lots of time getting to know. Work is the #1 source of a place where people spend time together and so a chance to get to know someone beyond a picture and a paragraph of text.