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I personally encountered unexplained behavior like this whenever I make comments critical to Apple (I'm specifically concerned with their "privacy" PR hiding a

I personally encountered unexplained behavior like this whenever I make comments critical to Apple (I'm specifically concerned with their "privacy" PR hiding a nascent mega-ad empire so mostly comment about that) and Elon Musk being anything but perfect (particularly expressing doubt on his new initiatives based on his track record of over-promising and -severely- underdelivering). I'm convinced there are genuine people that believe Apple / Musk can do no wrong, but the veracity of flagging and downvoting is making me suspicious to something more going on.

simondotau 4y ago
I don't think I've ever heard people claim that Apple or Musk "can do no wrong". Not even their most enthusiastic proponents. What I do hear from their proponents (including myself) is push-back on provably false claims, conspiracy theories, and opinions-declared-as-fact. I don't think you'll find many devout fans who will defend Apple's intransigence with the butterfly keyboard debacle. Or how they're marketing ProRes RAW video codecs on a smartphone that doesn't have a USB-C port. As for Musk, he's just a person. I am impressed by what he has achieved and I greatly admire his work ethic. That doesn't mean I defend the entirety of his character. But his flaws aren't reason for me to avoid rebutting claims which are obviously false, such as claims that he's just a "cheerleader" with no particular skills. You mention a "track record of over-promising and severely underdelivering" but I wonder if that's just a matter of which parts of his track record you place emphasis on. Far from over-promising or under-delivering, Falcon 9 is an astounding success. Dragon is an astounding success. Starlink is providing a level of service previously unheard of and is now the largest fleet of satellites by an enormous margin. The Model S was described as vapourware before its release, then it won multiple car of the year awards. The Model 3 was described as vapourware before its release, then it won multiple car of the year awards. The Model Y is currently the top selling car in Germany. I don't recall any of them turning out to be flops or disappointments. The yoke steering wheel was described as dangerous and maybe illegal, and it won't make it to any production vehicles, then it was released and the howls of controversy vanished overnight. Right now the criticism is focused on claims that Full Self Driving (FSD) Beta is vapourware. For a long time it was described as impossible. And also that it's scandalous how it is taking some years longer to complete than initially estimated. And also it doesn't work. And it is killing people. And it's unimpressive and Tesla's technology is dead last among competitors. Just don't look at YouTube.

simondotau 4y ago

I don't think I've ever heard people claim that Apple or Musk "can do no wrong". Not even their most enthusiastic proponents. What I do hear from their proponents (including myself) is push-back on provably false claims, conspiracy theories, and opinions-declared-as-fact. I don't think you'll find many devout fans who will defend Apple's intransigence with the butterfly keyboard debacle. Or how they're marketing ProRes RAW video codecs on a smartphone that doesn't have a USB-C port. As for Musk, he's just a person. I am impressed by what he has achieved and I greatly admire his work ethic. That doesn't mean I defend the entirety of his character. But his flaws aren't reason for me to avoid rebutting claims which are obviously false, such as claims that he's just a "cheerleader" with no particular skills. You mention a "track record of over-promising and severely underdelivering" but I wonder if that's just a matter of which parts of his track record you place emphasis on. Far from over-promising or under-delivering, Falcon 9 is an astounding success. Dragon is an astounding success. Starlink is providing a level of service previously unheard of and is now the largest fleet of satellites by an enormous margin. The Model S was described as vapourware before its release, then it won multiple car of the year awards. The Model 3 was described as vapourware before its release, then it won multiple car of the year awards. The Model Y is currently the top selling car in Germany. I don't recall any of them turning out to be flops or disappointments. The yoke steering wheel was described as dangerous and maybe illegal, and it won't make it to any production vehicles, then it was released and the howls of controversy vanished overnight. Right now the criticism is focused on claims that Full Self Driving (FSD) Beta is vapourware. For a long time it was described as impossible. And also that it's scandalous how it is taking some years longer to complete than initially estimated. And also it doesn't work. And it is killing people. And it's unimpressive and Tesla's technology is dead last among competitors. Just don't look at YouTube.