4 ms·

Can you provide any... yaknow... evidence that crime is going up on average? Just a quick Google implies that this is a complete fabrication https://www.sfgat

by camdat 4y ago

Can you provide any... yaknow... evidence that crime is going up on average? Just a quick Google implies that this is a complete fabrication https://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/San-Francisco-crime-Chesa-Boudin-London-Breed-16751930.php https://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/San-Francisco-crime-Che... https://www.sanfranciscopolice.org/stay-safe/crime-data/crime-dashboard https://www.sanfranciscopolice.org/stay-safe/crime-data/crim... https://www.sfchronicle.com/sf/article/san-francisco-crime-rates-17487348.php https://www.sfchronicle.com/sf/article/san-francisco-crime-r... >Ideology gets the best of people and they don't want to believe. The irony of saying this with no data to back up your claim, and the data that exists showing the exact opposite of your claim, is truly palpable

Brendinooo 4y ago
I’m not exactly invested in a side here, but doesn’t the first article concede that people aren’t reporting larceny crimes because the police aren’t doing anything about it?
CPLX 4y ago
The article you’re commenting on is evidence and data. Are you aware that you’re countering data gathered by a long-standing reputable newspaper with data gathered by the police department? Do you think there’s some other way of measuring theft besides people saying “I am the victim of a theft”?
- camdat 4y ago
  I don't see how it's useful evidence when there's no time series. What if more people were victims of crime in the past and this number has improved?
mc32 4y ago
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ca/san-francisco/crime https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ca/san-francisco/crime
- camdat 4y ago
  And? My links show crime has gotten better over time. Taking a snapshot of crime at one time is useless to understanding the delta. Would you be able to figure out the acceleration of a body given only it's velocity at one time?
DiggyJohnson 4y ago
Could your data not be completely accounted for by a decrease in public trust in police effectiveness to address instances of crime at the level of individual instances?
- camdat 4y ago
  Could you prove this is taking place? If not then I don't see how it invalidates the data. It could just as well be that people are more willing to report crime now. The only evidence available to us implies that crime is going down. Ideology is the only reason you might believe otherwise without evidence.
  - Brendinooo 4y ago
    I see smoke, but the fire department has not confirmed that there’s a fire. Therefore, there’s no fire, and ideology is the only reason I might believe? Note that I didn’t say “without evidence” at the end - smoke is evidence, as is an article that you’re commenting on talking about thefts that are common enough to make half of a city’s citizens victims in a five year period. And, you cite a source that notes that people aren’t reporting because nothing comes of it. I mean, what reason other than ideology would explain your unwillingness to take that stuff as evidence?
    - camdat 4y ago
      > I see smoke, but the fire department has not confirmed that there’s a fire. Therefore, there’s no fire, and ideology is the only reason I might believe? In this example you cold point to the smoke as first-hand evidence. Can you point to equivalent evidence that people are underreporting crimes? I'm only asking to see evidence showing underreporting, a claim you made. No ideology here.

by camdat 4y ago

Brendinooo 4y ago

I’m not exactly invested in a side here, but doesn’t the first article concede that people aren’t reporting larceny crimes because the police aren’t doing anything about it?

CPLX 4y ago

The article you’re commenting on is evidence and data. Are you aware that you’re countering data gathered by a long-standing reputable newspaper with data gathered by the police department? Do you think there’s some other way of measuring theft besides people saying “I am the victim of a theft”?

camdat 4y ago
I don't see how it's useful evidence when there's no time series. What if more people were victims of crime in the past and this number has improved?

mc32 4y ago

https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ca/san-francisco/crime https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ca/san-francisco/crime

camdat 4y ago
And? My links show crime has gotten better over time. Taking a snapshot of crime at one time is useless to understanding the delta. Would you be able to figure out the acceleration of a body given only it's velocity at one time?

DiggyJohnson 4y ago

Could your data not be completely accounted for by a decrease in public trust in police effectiveness to address instances of crime at the level of individual instances?

camdat 4y ago
Could you prove this is taking place? If not then I don't see how it invalidates the data. It could just as well be that people are more willing to report crime now. The only evidence available to us implies that crime is going down. Ideology is the only reason you might believe otherwise without evidence.
- Brendinooo 4y ago
  I see smoke, but the fire department has not confirmed that there’s a fire. Therefore, there’s no fire, and ideology is the only reason I might believe? Note that I didn’t say “without evidence” at the end - smoke is evidence, as is an article that you’re commenting on talking about thefts that are common enough to make half of a city’s citizens victims in a five year period. And, you cite a source that notes that people aren’t reporting because nothing comes of it. I mean, what reason other than ideology would explain your unwillingness to take that stuff as evidence?
  - camdat 4y ago
    > I see smoke, but the fire department has not confirmed that there’s a fire. Therefore, there’s no fire, and ideology is the only reason I might believe? In this example you cold point to the smoke as first-hand evidence. Can you point to equivalent evidence that people are underreporting crimes? I'm only asking to see evidence showing underreporting, a claim you made. No ideology here.