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He has the option to sue, but the way to gain respect is to demonstrate his ability in an environment that controls for any means of cheating posited by those w

He has the option to sue, but the way to gain respect is to demonstrate his ability in an environment that controls for any means of cheating posited by those who suspect him of doing so.

iLoveOncall 4y ago
He already did so, in the match that he won against Carlsen. The measures in all those tournaments are extremely stringent.
- mannykannot 4y ago
  Clearly some people whose opinions matter do not regard those measures as stringent enough to settle the issue.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - iLoveOncall 4y ago
    Do you have any idea of what is in place to prevent cheating in those competitions? The only possible improvement would be for the players to be naked. This is just an easy excuse. "He cheated!" "There are anticheat measures" "They're not good enough" It's a cycle that can never be solved. The loser can always claim the anticheat measures were "not enough". You know what. I think Carlsen has cheated in every single one of his games. Prove the contrary.
    - eimrine 4y ago
      > The only possible improvement would be for the players to be naked. Something might be placed inside the organism. > I think Carlsen has cheated in every single one of his games. Prove the contrary. That's easy. He streamed a lot of games with the tightest time requirements happening in the discipline, kind of 3 minutes per player plus extra 1 second per move. The speed of that game is so high that there is simply no time for having a conversations with cheating device. Also he always notice some suspicious moves (in not that fast games) which becomes correlating with chess engine.
      - carl_dr 4y ago
        > Something might be placed inside the organism https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked-before-the-fourth-round-of-the-sinquefield-cup-video/ https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked... Seems unlikely ...
        mannykannot 4y ago
        It is, however, testable, and Niemann is the person with greatest interest in publicly falsifying this or similar hypotheses.
      - iLoveOncall 4y ago
        > That's easy. He streamed a lot of games with the tightest time requirements happening in the discipline, kind of 3 minutes per player plus extra 1 second per move. The speed of that game is so high that there is simply no time for having a conversations with cheating device. Conversations? A cheating software can read the board and even move the pieces for him, this is ridiculous. 100% a cheater.
    - mannykannot 4y ago
      What can be proved about past games performed in less-than-fully-stringent conditions is beside the point. As far as I am concerned, once Niemann has passed all the tests his accusers can come up with, he would be vindicated, and they would be subject to opprobrium - it would be a vindication unavailable even through a successful libel suit. There's no infinite regress of suspicion in this view.
  - carl_dr 4y ago
    This is a video of Hans being checked before round 4 of the Sinquefield cup. https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked-before-the-fourth-round-of-the-sinquefield-cup-video/ https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked... I don't know what else they could have done other than full body x-ray him. Make your own mind up whether these checks are stringent. In addition, there was a 15 minute broadcast delay. His record in that tournament for rounds 4 though 9 was loss, draw, draw, win, draw. Hans was the lowest rated player in the tournament by 57 points.
    - mannykannot 4y ago
      That video itself immediately suggests some ways Niemann could offer to demonstrate he is not cheating, beginning with changing (under supervision) into clothing provided for him, and minimizing the number of people present at all stages. In any such proposal, he could reasonably require the same of his opponents and any monitors present.
dwild 4y ago
He tried, he even suggested to do a match naked...

He has the option to sue, but the way to gain respect is to demonstrate his ability in an environment that controls for any means of cheating posited by those who suspect him of doing so.

iLoveOncall 4y ago

He already did so, in the match that he won against Carlsen. The measures in all those tournaments are extremely stringent.

mannykannot 4y ago
Clearly some people whose opinions matter do not regard those measures as stringent enough to settle the issue.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- iLoveOncall 4y ago
  Do you have any idea of what is in place to prevent cheating in those competitions? The only possible improvement would be for the players to be naked. This is just an easy excuse. "He cheated!" "There are anticheat measures" "They're not good enough" It's a cycle that can never be solved. The loser can always claim the anticheat measures were "not enough". You know what. I think Carlsen has cheated in every single one of his games. Prove the contrary.
  - eimrine 4y ago
    > The only possible improvement would be for the players to be naked. Something might be placed inside the organism. > I think Carlsen has cheated in every single one of his games. Prove the contrary. That's easy. He streamed a lot of games with the tightest time requirements happening in the discipline, kind of 3 minutes per player plus extra 1 second per move. The speed of that game is so high that there is simply no time for having a conversations with cheating device. Also he always notice some suspicious moves (in not that fast games) which becomes correlating with chess engine.
    - carl_dr 4y ago
      > Something might be placed inside the organism https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked-before-the-fourth-round-of-the-sinquefield-cup-video/ https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked... Seems unlikely ...
      - mannykannot 4y ago
        It is, however, testable, and Niemann is the person with greatest interest in publicly falsifying this or similar hypotheses.
    - iLoveOncall 4y ago
      > That's easy. He streamed a lot of games with the tightest time requirements happening in the discipline, kind of 3 minutes per player plus extra 1 second per move. The speed of that game is so high that there is simply no time for having a conversations with cheating device. Conversations? A cheating software can read the board and even move the pieces for him, this is ridiculous. 100% a cheater.
  - mannykannot 4y ago
    What can be proved about past games performed in less-than-fully-stringent conditions is beside the point. As far as I am concerned, once Niemann has passed all the tests his accusers can come up with, he would be vindicated, and they would be subject to opprobrium - it would be a vindication unavailable even through a successful libel suit. There's no infinite regress of suspicion in this view.
- carl_dr 4y ago
  This is a video of Hans being checked before round 4 of the Sinquefield cup. https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked-before-the-fourth-round-of-the-sinquefield-cup-video/ https://www.chessdom.com/hans-niemann-was-thoroughly-checked... I don't know what else they could have done other than full body x-ray him. Make your own mind up whether these checks are stringent. In addition, there was a 15 minute broadcast delay. His record in that tournament for rounds 4 though 9 was loss, draw, draw, win, draw. Hans was the lowest rated player in the tournament by 57 points.
  - mannykannot 4y ago
    That video itself immediately suggests some ways Niemann could offer to demonstrate he is not cheating, beginning with changing (under supervision) into clothing provided for him, and minimizing the number of people present at all stages. In any such proposal, he could reasonably require the same of his opponents and any monitors present.

dwild 4y ago

He tried, he even suggested to do a match naked...