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Click bait title. Changes in behavior differ among age groups, with younger Americans using the saved commuting time to engage in leisure activities They

Click bait title. Changes in behavior differ among age groups, with younger Americans using the saved commuting time to engage in leisure activities They consider commute time as working. Which on some level I would like to agree with but none of my employers so far has paid me to commute so I do not consider it working. Yes of course I don't use the commute time I save to get more work hours in. Duh!

fundad 4y ago
Seriously they big mad that companies haven't reclaimed saved commute hours for work, they believe that time belongs to them SMDH. “decrease in hours worked away from home only partially offset by an increase in working at home” cue the violins. By the way, this is all during a period of rapid US economic expansion. You're welcome plutes.
- PM_me_your_math 4y ago
  What expansion? We've had two quarters of contraction. About to have a third, too, by all indicators.
- mandelbrotwurst 4y ago
  > a period of rapid US economic expansion Over what time period? GDP growth is in a long term (i.e. multiple decades) downtrend. Growth is up over the last couple of years if you cherry-pick and use the COVID/lockdown crash the starting point.
  - fundad 4y ago
    Q3, sorry to disappoint you
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
klyrs 4y ago
> none of my employers so far has paid me to commute so I do not consider it working. Yikes, do you apply that same reasoning to slavery, or is it only your own time that you consider worthless until paid for? re: makeitrain -- you don't work for Amazon, then?
- tharkun__ 4y ago
  I don't think you understood it the way I meant it. Let me explain. Commute time is time that I do not get any work output done. Employers know that and do not pay for that time. For me as an employee I have to basically treat this as "the cost of being employed" and I have a few knobs there. I can choose how far away I live, i.e. do I waste 15 minutes on the subway for this but pay high rent or for an expensive condo or do I waste 1.5 hours driving and paying for the maintenance, gas etc. each way and live in a nice house in the sticks. I may also have the option of taking a train for the 1.5 hour trip and I might be able to get an hour of work done on the train. Now it's up to my employer-employee relationship that I can get whether I am able to count this as work time or not. Some employers have strict policies: You gotta be at the office at 9 and clock in and clock out for lunch and back in and back out at 5. This is the time they count and you better be on time or you get dinged. Such an employer will not pay for your one hour of actual work you did on the commute. Other employers may not be as strict, people generally get to work around 9, no punch clocks but social pressure ensures that even if you did that hour of work on the train and do another hour of work on the train ride home, people only "see you at work" for 6 hours and think you're a slacker. So again effectively your employer does not pay your for your commute time i.e. I can't count it as work. It's my time. I may be fine with listening to an audio book or reading in that time and I might enjoy it. But it was never work time to begin with. I was just forced to make use of that time in some way in order to be employed somewhere to get money. Or you may be at a great place that understands this, some people come in at 7 and leave at 2, others come in at 11 and leave at 6. In any case, with WFH I can now finally do whatever I want with that time instead of being locked into doing something that I can do while commuting.
  - klyrs 4y ago
    I understand it the way you meant it. There are zero bona-fide reasons that I cannot work at home. If my employer wants me to battle traffic an hour each way, that's time taken away from myself and my family, it's fuel, wear & tear on my car, it's added stress and risk of permanent debilitating injuries -- all costs that my employer wants me to take on, for free, just because some exec who never comes to the office doesn't feel comfortable with peons doing the same. Getting to the office is work, and expense, that is not paid for. You're making an extremely narrow definition of "work" that your employer is delighted by. You're paying for the privilege of getting a paycheck. I'm saying that you aren't being paid for your time. Couple of scenarios: 1. Your employer wants you to go to a conference where you're to represent the company. Your "work" is programming, and your output is zero for the duration of the conference. Should you be paid for your time, should your plane & hotel costs be covered? 2. Your employer wants to buy some computers. The computers are worthless to your employer if they're sitting in a warehouse somewhere. Do they pay a shipping fee, or let them rot in the warehouse?
makeitrain 4y ago

fundad 4y ago

Seriously they big mad that companies haven't reclaimed saved commute hours for work, they believe that time belongs to them SMDH. “decrease in hours worked away from home only partially offset by an increase in working at home” cue the violins. By the way, this is all during a period of rapid US economic expansion. You're welcome plutes.

PM_me_your_math 4y ago
What expansion? We've had two quarters of contraction. About to have a third, too, by all indicators.
mandelbrotwurst 4y ago
> a period of rapid US economic expansion Over what time period? GDP growth is in a long term (i.e. multiple decades) downtrend. Growth is up over the last couple of years if you cherry-pick and use the COVID/lockdown crash the starting point.
- fundad 4y ago
  Q3, sorry to disappoint you
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]

klyrs 4y ago

> none of my employers so far has paid me to commute so I do not consider it working. Yikes, do you apply that same reasoning to slavery, or is it only your own time that you consider worthless until paid for? re: makeitrain -- you don't work for Amazon, then?

tharkun__ 4y ago
I don't think you understood it the way I meant it. Let me explain. Commute time is time that I do not get any work output done. Employers know that and do not pay for that time. For me as an employee I have to basically treat this as "the cost of being employed" and I have a few knobs there. I can choose how far away I live, i.e. do I waste 15 minutes on the subway for this but pay high rent or for an expensive condo or do I waste 1.5 hours driving and paying for the maintenance, gas etc. each way and live in a nice house in the sticks. I may also have the option of taking a train for the 1.5 hour trip and I might be able to get an hour of work done on the train. Now it's up to my employer-employee relationship that I can get whether I am able to count this as work time or not. Some employers have strict policies: You gotta be at the office at 9 and clock in and clock out for lunch and back in and back out at 5. This is the time they count and you better be on time or you get dinged. Such an employer will not pay for your one hour of actual work you did on the commute. Other employers may not be as strict, people generally get to work around 9, no punch clocks but social pressure ensures that even if you did that hour of work on the train and do another hour of work on the train ride home, people only "see you at work" for 6 hours and think you're a slacker. So again effectively your employer does not pay your for your commute time i.e. I can't count it as work. It's my time. I may be fine with listening to an audio book or reading in that time and I might enjoy it. But it was never work time to begin with. I was just forced to make use of that time in some way in order to be employed somewhere to get money. Or you may be at a great place that understands this, some people come in at 7 and leave at 2, others come in at 11 and leave at 6. In any case, with WFH I can now finally do whatever I want with that time instead of being locked into doing something that I can do while commuting.
- klyrs 4y ago
  I understand it the way you meant it. There are zero bona-fide reasons that I cannot work at home. If my employer wants me to battle traffic an hour each way, that's time taken away from myself and my family, it's fuel, wear & tear on my car, it's added stress and risk of permanent debilitating injuries -- all costs that my employer wants me to take on, for free, just because some exec who never comes to the office doesn't feel comfortable with peons doing the same. Getting to the office is work, and expense, that is not paid for. You're making an extremely narrow definition of "work" that your employer is delighted by. You're paying for the privilege of getting a paycheck. I'm saying that you aren't being paid for your time. Couple of scenarios: 1. Your employer wants you to go to a conference where you're to represent the company. Your "work" is programming, and your output is zero for the duration of the conference. Should you be paid for your time, should your plane & hotel costs be covered? 2. Your employer wants to buy some computers. The computers are worthless to your employer if they're sitting in a warehouse somewhere. Do they pay a shipping fee, or let them rot in the warehouse?

makeitrain 4y ago