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There is also the option that MS claims: Copilot may be perfectly fine as it is, BUT you may not be allowed to distribute (or even use internally) code it gener

There is also the option that MS claims: Copilot may be perfectly fine as it is, BUT you may not be allowed to distribute (or even use internally) code it generates for you. This is what the current terms of service of Copilot say: you as the user are responsible for ensuring you are not breaking anyone's copyright when you accept an auto-completion from Copilot. How you would know that it just spit out someone else's code is unspecified, of course. Of course, similar tools that make it easy to infringe others' copyright are less accepted when they don't come from corporate behemoths (cough Popcorn Time cough), but such is the world we live: copyright protection for me but not for thee.

thesuperbigfrog 4y ago
>> This is what the current terms of service of Copilot say: you as the user are responsible for ensuring you are not breaking anyone's copyright when you accept an auto-completion from Copilot. How you would know that it just spit out someone else's code is unspecified, of course. This is the key point. If they were confident that the "generated" code did not violate any copyright or licenses then they would be using Copilot internally or offering indemnity for commercial users of Copilot. Is Microsoft or Github using Copilot for the proprietary software products they sell? (that is, are they "dog-fooding" Copilot?) What corporate legal team would be willing to sign off on the use of Copilot for a software product that is sold and distributed? If the "generated" code is licensed under the GPL and it gets mixed into a proprietary software product then the terms of the GPL have been violated and the proprietary code falls under the GPL.
- toqy 4y ago
  > or offering indemnity for commercial users of Copilot Their enterprise offering is not available yet, so we don't if that is the case or not
- yamtaddle 4y ago
  > Is Microsoft or Github using Copilot for the proprietary software products they sell? (that is, are they "dog-fooding" Copilot?) Yeah, that's my question. Are MS devs allowed to use Copilot? For, say, developing Windows? Edge? Office? If no, then I'm gonna continue to stay the hell away from it.
- P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
  I think companies have gotten so relaxed about indemnity because of things like section 230 protection and the typical EULA claiming no responsibility that they're now trying to extend it where it doesn't belong. In any other industry, MS WOULD offer indemnity protection or it would be dead-in-the-water and no company would even attempt what MS is attempting to do. Big tech really needs to be reigned in.
remram 4y ago
Where is this? The terms of service I could find for Copilot state: > The code, functions, and other output returned to you by GitHub Copilot are called “Suggestions.” GitHub does not claim any rights in Suggestions, and you retain ownership of and responsibility for Your Code, including Suggestions you include in Your Code. It's not super clear ("retain"?) but I understand it as claiming that you own the copyright on the suggestions you get when you run Copilot. Source: https://docs.github.com/en/site-policy/github-terms/github-terms-for-additional-products-and-features#github-copilot https://docs.github.com/en/site-policy/github-terms/github-t...
- simiones 4y ago
  Here it is in their FAQ [0]: > Other than the filter, what other measures can I take to assess code suggested by GitHub Copilot? > You should take the same precautions as you would with any code you write that uses material you did not independently originate. These include rigorous testing, IP scanning [IP == intellectual property, in this context - my note], and checking for security vulnerabilities. You should make sure your IDE or editor does not automatically compile or run generated code before you review it. I believe the "you retain ownership and responsibility for Your Code, including Suggestions" is the part that covers this in the terms of service. [0] https://github.com/features/copilot#faq-human-oversight https://github.com/features/copilot#faq-human-oversight
nominusllc 4y ago
> Copilot may be perfectly fine as it is, BUT you may not be allowed to distribute (or even use internally) code it generates for you. This will just encourage stolen (and now closed source) code.

thesuperbigfrog 4y ago

>> This is what the current terms of service of Copilot say: you as the user are responsible for ensuring you are not breaking anyone's copyright when you accept an auto-completion from Copilot. How you would know that it just spit out someone else's code is unspecified, of course. This is the key point. If they were confident that the "generated" code did not violate any copyright or licenses then they would be using Copilot internally or offering indemnity for commercial users of Copilot. Is Microsoft or Github using Copilot for the proprietary software products they sell? (that is, are they "dog-fooding" Copilot?) What corporate legal team would be willing to sign off on the use of Copilot for a software product that is sold and distributed? If the "generated" code is licensed under the GPL and it gets mixed into a proprietary software product then the terms of the GPL have been violated and the proprietary code falls under the GPL.

toqy 4y ago
> or offering indemnity for commercial users of Copilot Their enterprise offering is not available yet, so we don't if that is the case or not
yamtaddle 4y ago
> Is Microsoft or Github using Copilot for the proprietary software products they sell? (that is, are they "dog-fooding" Copilot?) Yeah, that's my question. Are MS devs allowed to use Copilot? For, say, developing Windows? Edge? Office? If no, then I'm gonna continue to stay the hell away from it.
P5fRxh5kUvp2th 4y ago
I think companies have gotten so relaxed about indemnity because of things like section 230 protection and the typical EULA claiming no responsibility that they're now trying to extend it where it doesn't belong. In any other industry, MS WOULD offer indemnity protection or it would be dead-in-the-water and no company would even attempt what MS is attempting to do. Big tech really needs to be reigned in.

remram 4y ago

Where is this? The terms of service I could find for Copilot state: > The code, functions, and other output returned to you by GitHub Copilot are called “Suggestions.” GitHub does not claim any rights in Suggestions, and you retain ownership of and responsibility for Your Code, including Suggestions you include in Your Code. It's not super clear ("retain"?) but I understand it as claiming that you own the copyright on the suggestions you get when you run Copilot. Source: https://docs.github.com/en/site-policy/github-terms/github-terms-for-additional-products-and-features#github-copilot https://docs.github.com/en/site-policy/github-terms/github-t...

simiones 4y ago
Here it is in their FAQ [0]: > Other than the filter, what other measures can I take to assess code suggested by GitHub Copilot? > You should take the same precautions as you would with any code you write that uses material you did not independently originate. These include rigorous testing, IP scanning [IP == intellectual property, in this context - my note], and checking for security vulnerabilities. You should make sure your IDE or editor does not automatically compile or run generated code before you review it. I believe the "you retain ownership and responsibility for Your Code, including Suggestions" is the part that covers this in the terms of service. [0] https://github.com/features/copilot#faq-human-oversight https://github.com/features/copilot#faq-human-oversight

nominusllc 4y ago

> Copilot may be perfectly fine as it is, BUT you may not be allowed to distribute (or even use internally) code it generates for you. This will just encourage stolen (and now closed source) code.