3 ms·

I agree the new products that Apple released yesterday are underwhelming but this author lost me with constantly saying "Plus the cost of the keyboard" or even

I agree the new products that Apple released yesterday are underwhelming but this author lost me with constantly saying "Plus the cost of the keyboard" or even rolling it's price into the iPad price to inflate it even further. It feels very dishonest. So now we can just add all the accessories a device has to the price and pretend that's the price? I've owned multiple iPads (minis) and used many other iPads, I've never used a keyboard with them, I'd never consider the cost of an accessory like a keyboard when thinking about the iPad price itself. Like maybe factor in a case/cover but even that's a stretch since every tablet needs that, Apple or not.

giraffe_lady 4y ago
The early framing of it was that they usually offer this as an alternative to a laptop for certain use cases. In that context including the price of the keyboard makes sense.
- whiskers 4y ago
  But they specifically refer to the price of the old model as $329 which doesn't include the keyboard. They are moving the goalposts to try to make this a story. It isn't a story, it's nonsense.
  - Apocryphon 4y ago
    Well, even if you only compare the base prices, $449 is still a 36% increase.
    - whiskers 4y ago
      Then write about that - that's not the clickbait angle they have gone for. A large chunk of that 36% can be explained by inflation - heck perhaps until now they have been artificially keeping the base price low to capture marketshare - who knows? Full disclosure: I believe that the new price point makes iPad a much less compelling option. I also hate the way the article framed it. There was no need to construct a false reality when they could have simply run with 36% price increase - that's story enough.
  - coldtea 4y ago
    They don't compare the old model price with the new plus keyboard and pencil. What they do is compare the old model price with the new one, and then go on to say the total cost of the new unit to get it with full functionality as a desktop replacement. So, they don't say: "old model was $329, new is close to $800". They say: "old model was $329, new is $449. That's quite a lot to get one. Especially since, on top of the already high price, you'll have to fork $348 more if you want the full desktop replacement experience with the extra mouse and keyboard".
tacker2000 4y ago
Sure, but the author is reviewing it as a laptop replacement and as such the keyboard is necessary.
- redbell 4y ago
  Not sure, but I feel you might not get the point the above commenter is saying. The 9th gen iPad costs $329 , the 10th gen costs $449, and, while it's clear that is a considerable raise for a "budget" tablet (+36%), the author, added an extra $249+$99 (keyboard + pencil) to inflate the price of the iPad 10 up to $800, then compares the new price to iPad 9 price. Doing basic math here, we might be tricked that the new price is more than doubled. Which I consider it a logical fallacy, where you tweak one side of the equation to reach a desired result.
  - coldtea 4y ago
    Well, the price might not have doubled for the new iPad alone, but Apple has doubled down on pushing the iPad as a desktop replacement and pushing the keyboard and pencil as much have accessories many new advertised iPad OS features are build for.
    - Tagbert 4y ago
      And yet they are not required to use the iPad unless you chose to adopt those keyboard centric use cases. It is valid to say that the price of the iPad is $449 + #350 for optional accessories but to just roll those prices into it is misleading to people who aren’t looking for the mythical laptop replacement.
      - coldtea 4y ago
        >And yet they are not required to use the iPad unless you chose to adopt those keyboard centric use cases. Well, those are what's pushed in Apple's ads, and those are what the article checks for overall cost for: the desktop replacement case
coldtea 4y ago
>It feels very dishonest. Not that dishonest. The features Apple has been touting for the modern iPads are about how it can be "a computer" with a keyboard and everything (they have entire ads for the iPad mind you, not the keyboard, that show it used with the keyboard), and also the way it can be used for notetaking, marking annotations, text recognition, and so on with the pencil. Again those two are prominent in the ads and marketing for the iPad, not in separate ads for those alone. So, both are things people would like to have, and some of the main points of getting an iPad. But they are sold separately, and in unreasonable cost for what they are (heck, the Pencil going for $99 is the 5+ years old one, not even the second gen - which the new iPad doesn't support anyway). >So now we can just add all the accessories a device has to the price and pretend that's the price? Why not? When I buy a printer I also check how much its ink sets cost. And if I buy something whose main marketing focus touted as a selling point to me is how great it is with some accessories, I check how much those cost too. Especially if otherwise it's a ho-hum update over previous generations.
- Tagbert 4y ago
  A printer does not work without ink. An iPad works quite well without a keyboard and pen. It may not work as well for all use cases for all people but it works fully as a tablet without those things. Apple may show it being used in other ways but that doesn’t mean that those accessories are required. Folding those into the price will only scare off people who just want a basic tablet and screen.

giraffe_lady 4y ago

The early framing of it was that they usually offer this as an alternative to a laptop for certain use cases. In that context including the price of the keyboard makes sense.

whiskers 4y ago
But they specifically refer to the price of the old model as $329 which doesn't include the keyboard. They are moving the goalposts to try to make this a story. It isn't a story, it's nonsense.
- Apocryphon 4y ago
  Well, even if you only compare the base prices, $449 is still a 36% increase.
  - whiskers 4y ago
    Then write about that - that's not the clickbait angle they have gone for. A large chunk of that 36% can be explained by inflation - heck perhaps until now they have been artificially keeping the base price low to capture marketshare - who knows? Full disclosure: I believe that the new price point makes iPad a much less compelling option. I also hate the way the article framed it. There was no need to construct a false reality when they could have simply run with 36% price increase - that's story enough.
- coldtea 4y ago
  They don't compare the old model price with the new plus keyboard and pencil. What they do is compare the old model price with the new one, and then go on to say the total cost of the new unit to get it with full functionality as a desktop replacement. So, they don't say: "old model was $329, new is close to $800". They say: "old model was $329, new is $449. That's quite a lot to get one. Especially since, on top of the already high price, you'll have to fork $348 more if you want the full desktop replacement experience with the extra mouse and keyboard".

tacker2000 4y ago

Sure, but the author is reviewing it as a laptop replacement and as such the keyboard is necessary.

redbell 4y ago
Not sure, but I feel you might not get the point the above commenter is saying. The 9th gen iPad costs $329 , the 10th gen costs $449, and, while it's clear that is a considerable raise for a "budget" tablet (+36%), the author, added an extra $249+$99 (keyboard + pencil) to inflate the price of the iPad 10 up to $800, then compares the new price to iPad 9 price. Doing basic math here, we might be tricked that the new price is more than doubled. Which I consider it a logical fallacy, where you tweak one side of the equation to reach a desired result.
- coldtea 4y ago
  Well, the price might not have doubled for the new iPad alone, but Apple has doubled down on pushing the iPad as a desktop replacement and pushing the keyboard and pencil as much have accessories many new advertised iPad OS features are build for.
  - Tagbert 4y ago
    And yet they are not required to use the iPad unless you chose to adopt those keyboard centric use cases. It is valid to say that the price of the iPad is $449 + #350 for optional accessories but to just roll those prices into it is misleading to people who aren’t looking for the mythical laptop replacement.
    - coldtea 4y ago
      >And yet they are not required to use the iPad unless you chose to adopt those keyboard centric use cases. Well, those are what's pushed in Apple's ads, and those are what the article checks for overall cost for: the desktop replacement case

coldtea 4y ago

>It feels very dishonest. Not that dishonest. The features Apple has been touting for the modern iPads are about how it can be "a computer" with a keyboard and everything (they have entire ads for the iPad mind you, not the keyboard, that show it used with the keyboard), and also the way it can be used for notetaking, marking annotations, text recognition, and so on with the pencil. Again those two are prominent in the ads and marketing for the iPad, not in separate ads for those alone. So, both are things people would like to have, and some of the main points of getting an iPad. But they are sold separately, and in unreasonable cost for what they are (heck, the Pencil going for $99 is the 5+ years old one, not even the second gen - which the new iPad doesn't support anyway). >So now we can just add all the accessories a device has to the price and pretend that's the price? Why not? When I buy a printer I also check how much its ink sets cost. And if I buy something whose main marketing focus touted as a selling point to me is how great it is with some accessories, I check how much those cost too. Especially if otherwise it's a ho-hum update over previous generations.

Tagbert 4y ago
A printer does not work without ink. An iPad works quite well without a keyboard and pen. It may not work as well for all use cases for all people but it works fully as a tablet without those things. Apple may show it being used in other ways but that doesn’t mean that those accessories are required. Folding those into the price will only scare off people who just want a basic tablet and screen.