5 ms·

Care to explain why?

sieabahlpark 4y ago
password4321 4y ago
Oracle / licensing edit: IIRC the official Java runtime auto-update happily upgraded to not-even-free-as-in-beer pretty nonchalantly. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28543265 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28543265 (2021) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20799424 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20799424 (2019)
- anotherrandom 4y ago
  I don't understand this complaint anymore. Hotspot and OpenJDK are all GPL, licensing and Oracle aren't worries at this point
- chrisseaton 4y ago
  It's GPL with the 'classpath exception' so that you're even exempt from the GPL the you link. Seems pretty good licensing? Do you prefer even more permissive than that?
- mahmoudimus 4y ago
  This is no longer a real reason. It's licensed as GPL with a "classpath exception." That's pretty permissive and this article[0] does a pretty good job of explaining some questions you may have. [0]: https://www.mend.io/resources/blog/top-9-gpl-with-the-classpath-exception-questions-answered/ https://www.mend.io/resources/blog/top-9-gpl-with-the-classp...
onebot 4y ago
Java was great at the time it was created. But now, I think there are several better languages that are more suited for today. Like Go as an example. Easy to develop and easy to maintain. You get very good performance for little effort. It is just my personal preference, but I don't care to maintain Java or JVM anymore. FWIW, I was at the very first every Java One conference. Have used it for many years.
- mahmoudimus 4y ago
  It might make sense to revisit your stance given the most recent JEPs that have been introduced. Java 19 introduced virtual threads and structured concurrency, which will arguably make Java + the JVM a great alternative to Go, etc. Especially since it's very backward compatible. W/ Graal as well, the AOT compilation comes 90% of JIT performance. I really think the JVM is an exciting eco-system that has a very bright future if it keeps going the way it is. Brian Goetz' "Paving the on-ramp" discusses how to reduce the boilerplate even further. So these things are definitely a priority for the Java/JVM team[0]. [0]: https://openjdk.org/projects/amber/design-notes/on-ramp https://openjdk.org/projects/amber/design-notes/on-ramp
- AzzieElbab 4y ago
  I haven’t seen a single business app written in Go
zinclozenge 4y ago
I'm not the OP, but generally JVM applications are very resource hungry under small loads, although I will concede this matters less as load increases, and the extreme OOP style of programming that Java encourages, in my opinion, leads to a lot of faults that require more operational babysitting than I'm ok with. I don't have any empirical evidence, just experience. As such I'm very biased against it.

Oracle / licensing edit: IIRC the official Java runtime auto-update happily upgraded to not-even-free-as-in-beer pretty nonchalantly. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28543265 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28543265 (2021) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20799424 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20799424 (2019)

anotherrandom 4y ago
I don't understand this complaint anymore. Hotspot and OpenJDK are all GPL, licensing and Oracle aren't worries at this point
chrisseaton 4y ago
It's GPL with the 'classpath exception' so that you're even exempt from the GPL the you link. Seems pretty good licensing? Do you prefer even more permissive than that?
mahmoudimus 4y ago
This is no longer a real reason. It's licensed as GPL with a "classpath exception." That's pretty permissive and this article[0] does a pretty good job of explaining some questions you may have. [0]: https://www.mend.io/resources/blog/top-9-gpl-with-the-classpath-exception-questions-answered/ https://www.mend.io/resources/blog/top-9-gpl-with-the-classp...

onebot 4y ago

Java was great at the time it was created. But now, I think there are several better languages that are more suited for today. Like Go as an example. Easy to develop and easy to maintain. You get very good performance for little effort. It is just my personal preference, but I don't care to maintain Java or JVM anymore. FWIW, I was at the very first every Java One conference. Have used it for many years.

mahmoudimus 4y ago
It might make sense to revisit your stance given the most recent JEPs that have been introduced. Java 19 introduced virtual threads and structured concurrency, which will arguably make Java + the JVM a great alternative to Go, etc. Especially since it's very backward compatible. W/ Graal as well, the AOT compilation comes 90% of JIT performance. I really think the JVM is an exciting eco-system that has a very bright future if it keeps going the way it is. Brian Goetz' "Paving the on-ramp" discusses how to reduce the boilerplate even further. So these things are definitely a priority for the Java/JVM team[0]. [0]: https://openjdk.org/projects/amber/design-notes/on-ramp https://openjdk.org/projects/amber/design-notes/on-ramp
AzzieElbab 4y ago
I haven’t seen a single business app written in Go

zinclozenge 4y ago

I'm not the OP, but generally JVM applications are very resource hungry under small loads, although I will concede this matters less as load increases, and the extreme OOP style of programming that Java encourages, in my opinion, leads to a lot of faults that require more operational babysitting than I'm ok with. I don't have any empirical evidence, just experience. As such I'm very biased against it.