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I enjoy being a parent but my advice to people who ask if they should have kids is that you really have to want to have kids because all the benefits are intang

I enjoy being a parent but my advice to people who ask if they should have kids is that you really have to want to have kids because all the benefits are intangible and all the drawbacks are tangible. People who say they don't want kids, usually mean it - whether they've identified their real reason or not.

knaekhoved 4y ago
People say they want or don't want a lot of things, but it turns out they're often really bad at predicting net utilitarian impacts. A lot of people who say stuff like "I don't want to have kids because I'm happier buying funko pops and video games" are probably just wrong about their counterfactual happiness level.
julianlam 4y ago
> all the benefits are intangible and all the drawbacks are tangible. That's quite well-said. I've heard it expressed many different ways but this one I think I'll appropriate :)
dragonsky67 4y ago
I'm not sure why there is a stigma to deciding to not have kids. It's not as if your decision is going to have much impact on anybody except yourself or the potential grandparents who may feel that they are missing out, but that is very much their problem. All this talk of "perpetuating the species" is so much crap... The species will get along quite well without everybody contributing their genetic material. At least those who decide not to have kids are making a thoughtful decision, many unfortunately can't or dont.
- Poppys 4y ago
  There are tangible problems with a low birth rate though, which western economies are experiencing now.
  - frontman1988 4y ago
    That's just a transitionary problem. Even just 50 years ago there were half of us as now. 99% of humanity's history has had less than 1 billion people. 8 billion people is way more than needed and it's showing it's ill impacts on the enviroment as well.
  - chronofar 4y ago
    There are also tangible benefits. Economic models needing to adjust to non-perpetual growth is not an impossible nor existential crisis.
    - Tade0 4y ago
      The main problem isn't growth or the lack of it - it's generally decreased welfare of older people because there's no family member or caregiver to periodically check up on them and recognize early signs of deteriorating health - especially mental health.
      - chronofar 4y ago
        Again, this is a very fixable problem, and society will be the better for it by learning to adapt better rather than just throwing more kids at the problem. Kids do not owe their parents anything, including geriatric care.
        Tade0 4y ago
        If it's fixable, then the fix was not implemented in societies which are aging the most. People don't owe their parents anything, but they naturally do at least give a shit about them - provided they had a good relationship. Less kids, less adults who would volunteer to do it.
        chronofar 4y ago
        Hasn’t it? There is considerably more infrastructure for the elderly today than a couple of generations ago. Communities where folks can maintain a bit of independence with caregivers and peers in the neighborhood seems like a nearly ideal way to age to me. But of course not everyone lives like this and many have a horrible quality of life at the end so there is room to improve. One improvement is cultural I think: we shouldn’t be hanging on to every last strand of life possible, and should make it easy for those with little prognosis for quality of life to die gracefully in a way of their choosing. In any case certainly more adaptation is needed, but I see signs of the development.
- fountainofage 4y ago
  > I'm not sure why there is a stigma to deciding to not have kids. > It's not as if your decision is going to have much impact on anybody except yourself That's pretty much every stigma, though, so it also makes sense why this one exists, too.
tiborsaas 4y ago
> People who say they don't want kids, usually mean it Quite true, I'm almost 40 and still have a bunch of things that interest me way more than changing diapers and worrying myself to death.

knaekhoved 4y ago

People say they want or don't want a lot of things, but it turns out they're often really bad at predicting net utilitarian impacts. A lot of people who say stuff like "I don't want to have kids because I'm happier buying funko pops and video games" are probably just wrong about their counterfactual happiness level.

julianlam 4y ago

> all the benefits are intangible and all the drawbacks are tangible. That's quite well-said. I've heard it expressed many different ways but this one I think I'll appropriate :)

dragonsky67 4y ago

I'm not sure why there is a stigma to deciding to not have kids. It's not as if your decision is going to have much impact on anybody except yourself or the potential grandparents who may feel that they are missing out, but that is very much their problem. All this talk of "perpetuating the species" is so much crap... The species will get along quite well without everybody contributing their genetic material. At least those who decide not to have kids are making a thoughtful decision, many unfortunately can't or dont.

Poppys 4y ago
There are tangible problems with a low birth rate though, which western economies are experiencing now.
- frontman1988 4y ago
  That's just a transitionary problem. Even just 50 years ago there were half of us as now. 99% of humanity's history has had less than 1 billion people. 8 billion people is way more than needed and it's showing it's ill impacts on the enviroment as well.
- chronofar 4y ago
  There are also tangible benefits. Economic models needing to adjust to non-perpetual growth is not an impossible nor existential crisis.
  - Tade0 4y ago
    The main problem isn't growth or the lack of it - it's generally decreased welfare of older people because there's no family member or caregiver to periodically check up on them and recognize early signs of deteriorating health - especially mental health.
    - chronofar 4y ago
      Again, this is a very fixable problem, and society will be the better for it by learning to adapt better rather than just throwing more kids at the problem. Kids do not owe their parents anything, including geriatric care.
      - Tade0 4y ago
        If it's fixable, then the fix was not implemented in societies which are aging the most. People don't owe their parents anything, but they naturally do at least give a shit about them - provided they had a good relationship. Less kids, less adults who would volunteer to do it.
        chronofar 4y ago
        Hasn’t it? There is considerably more infrastructure for the elderly today than a couple of generations ago. Communities where folks can maintain a bit of independence with caregivers and peers in the neighborhood seems like a nearly ideal way to age to me. But of course not everyone lives like this and many have a horrible quality of life at the end so there is room to improve. One improvement is cultural I think: we shouldn’t be hanging on to every last strand of life possible, and should make it easy for those with little prognosis for quality of life to die gracefully in a way of their choosing. In any case certainly more adaptation is needed, but I see signs of the development.
fountainofage 4y ago
> I'm not sure why there is a stigma to deciding to not have kids. > It's not as if your decision is going to have much impact on anybody except yourself That's pretty much every stigma, though, so it also makes sense why this one exists, too.

tiborsaas 4y ago

> People who say they don't want kids, usually mean it Quite true, I'm almost 40 and still have a bunch of things that interest me way more than changing diapers and worrying myself to death.