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You're right about dogs, but dogs cannot build radio telescopes so I don't understand the point. To be capable of interstellar communication, you have to be abl

by vecter 4y ago

You're right about dogs, but dogs cannot build radio telescopes so I don't understand the point. To be capable of interstellar communication, you have to be able to build machines, and doing so requires a systematic engineering culture and understanding of at least basic principles. To put it differently, do you think such an advanced civilization would not be able to do something as simple as calculus, which would be far more advanced than manipulating a basic truth table? They almost certainly won't do it in any language that we understand on Earth, but they'll be manipulating and reasoning about the same concepts.

wizofaus 4y ago
I honestly don't know, but I do think it's dangerous to assume an alien mind capable of interstellar communication would "think" sufficiently like human brains do for abstract concepts like calculus to be necessary or even make sense.
- vecter 4y ago
  They would have to have developed calculus in order to build radio telescopes. We're not talking about how they think, we're talking about their understanding of concepts. These concepts are all hard prerequisites to being a species that can communicate across the stars.
  - wizofaus 4y ago
    But what does "understanding of a concept" mean if you have no idea how they think? And I disagree, I reckon even as humans we could come up with ways we might be able to build a device able to send radio signals interstellar distances without even having any real understanding of how it works. After all, beings as complex as ourselves came into existence via mechanisms that didn't involve, as far as we know, any sort of sentient understanding of the concepts of natural selection or basic laws of physics/chemistry/biology that you might think would be "hard prerequisites" for an ecosystem that can generate such an outcome. If there were a high selective pressure for the ability to transmit long-distance radio signals, do you really think natural selection could never have led to species natively capable of doing so?

by vecter 4y ago

wizofaus 4y ago

I honestly don't know, but I do think it's dangerous to assume an alien mind capable of interstellar communication would "think" sufficiently like human brains do for abstract concepts like calculus to be necessary or even make sense.

vecter 4y ago
They would have to have developed calculus in order to build radio telescopes. We're not talking about how they think, we're talking about their understanding of concepts. These concepts are all hard prerequisites to being a species that can communicate across the stars.
- wizofaus 4y ago
  But what does "understanding of a concept" mean if you have no idea how they think? And I disagree, I reckon even as humans we could come up with ways we might be able to build a device able to send radio signals interstellar distances without even having any real understanding of how it works. After all, beings as complex as ourselves came into existence via mechanisms that didn't involve, as far as we know, any sort of sentient understanding of the concepts of natural selection or basic laws of physics/chemistry/biology that you might think would be "hard prerequisites" for an ecosystem that can generate such an outcome. If there were a high selective pressure for the ability to transmit long-distance radio signals, do you really think natural selection could never have led to species natively capable of doing so?