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Working for the butcher prince. We don't need that kind of people near any NATO army. Let's hope they stay in Saudi Arabia. In other news, this is just another

Working for the butcher prince. We don't need that kind of people near any NATO army. Let's hope they stay in Saudi Arabia. In other news, this is just another symptom of a shrinking US empire. Pax americana is starting to crumble.

whywhywhydude 4y ago
- dendrite9 4y ago
  Like this? https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/technology/twitter-saudi-arabia-spying-ahmad-abouammo.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/technology/twitter-saudi-... A former Twitter employee was convicted on Tuesday by a jury in federal court of six charges related to accusations that he spied on the company’s users for Saudi Arabia. While at Twitter, Ahmad Abouammo, 44, managed media partnerships in the Middle East and North Africa. He developed relationships with prominent individuals in the region, receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars and a luxury watch from a top adviser to Saudi Arabia’s crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman. In return, prosecutors said, he shared the personal user information of dissidents with Saudi officials. The jury convicted Mr. Abouammo of two counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud, two counts of money laundering, one count of falsifying records and one count of acting as an agent of a foreign government without properly disclosing that work. It found Mr. Abouammo not guilty on five counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud.
  - whywhywhydude 4y ago
    That is really scary. They probably have insiders in their payroll in every major tech company.
    - lesuorac 4y ago
      Why wouldn't they? If you had a budget of ~1T for several decades how would you (acting as MBS) spend it all?
    - Der_Einzige 4y ago
      I just assume that once you get into the FAANG caliber of compensation in the US tech industry (and possibly well before that), that suddenly the walls, and everything else starts listening and glowing.
- justapassenger 4y ago
  I didn't downvote the op. I downvoted you. Having someone to disagree with your stance doesn't mean there's a conspiracy.
- jm4 4y ago
  It’s probably because of the second paragraph. The first is a sentiment many people can agree with. The second paragraph, asserting not only that the U.S. is crumbling but that somehow retired generals working in SA is proof is utterly ridiculous.
jeanluc_discard 4y ago
Generals who oversaw Abu Ghraib are no different. Pax Americana is definitely crumbling before our eyes.
- jdminhbg 4y ago
  It's ok for two different things to both be bad, we don't have to pretend they're the same.
  - sudosysgen 4y ago
    I don't see much of a difference between the two. They're both institutional murder and torture.
    - hey2022 4y ago
      There is action and there is the reaction. You could argue that the action is identical. But the reaction—internal, institutional, political—was and is not participating similar. People in power will abuse power. That’s inevitable in any regime. What makes the difference is how they are held accountable, especially by their own regime.
  - googlryas 4y ago
    They're similar in that they're both beyond the pale. For example, Manadel al-Jamadi was murdered in detention, while being tortured by the US military. The people who murdered him then took "thumbs up" photos with his corpse. No one was punished for his murder. NSFW, his corpse is pictured on this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Manadel_al-Jamadi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Manadel_al-Jamadi
mbostleman 4y ago
Crumbling for sure. But incredible turn arounds have happened before. Consider the US posture at the end of the 1970s vs only a decade later.
jmyeet 4y ago
While I'm in general agreement that we should stop treating Saudi Arabia like it's the ally we want it to be given their actions in Yemen, with OPEC and their direct ties to 9/11. But your comment is particularly funny because you brought up NATO [1]: > One typical example is General Adolf Heusinger, a career military officer who, with the outbreak of the Second World War, became part of the German headquarters field staff and helped plan the Nazi invasions of Poland, Denmark, Norway, France and the Low Countries. The Nazis perpetrated against Poland one of the worst crimes history has ever known. Poland suffered the largest number of casualties per capita of any European country, with a total of about six million people killed. Heusinger rose quickly through the Wehrmacht’s administrative ranks and in 1944 was appointed Adolf Hitler’s Chief of the General Staff of the Army. > With the 1955 establishment of the Bundeswehr, the reconstituted West German Armed Forces, Heusinger returned to military service, and was appointed Lieutenant-General in 1955. In 1957, he was promoted to full general and named the first Inspector-General of the Bundeswehr. He served in that capacity until 1961. In 1961, Heusinger was appointed Chairman of the NATO Military Committee, making him the senior military spokesperson for NATO and in 1963 he also became NATO’s chief of staff, serving in that capacity until 1964. There were a number of other ex-Nazis in NATO's ranks and leadership. [1]: https://cpcml.ca/itn220328-tmld-art4/ https://cpcml.ca/itn220328-tmld-art4/
g8oz 4y ago
Under both Obama and Trump the US provided *direct* logistical and targeting support for the Saudi bombing of Yemeni targets. Biden finally stopped it in 2021. The humanitarian catastrophe in Yemen would not have happened without U.S acquiescence. Saudi Arabia is not a U.S adversary, it is an ungrateful client state and has been since Roosevelt.
mise_en_place 4y ago
> Pax americana is starting to crumble. You mean Pax Israel is starting to crumble. Is it a coincidence that Yair Lapid is now advocating for a two state solution? They see the writing on the wall.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

whywhywhydude 4y ago

dendrite9 4y ago
Like this? https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/technology/twitter-saudi-arabia-spying-ahmad-abouammo.html https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/09/technology/twitter-saudi-... A former Twitter employee was convicted on Tuesday by a jury in federal court of six charges related to accusations that he spied on the company’s users for Saudi Arabia. While at Twitter, Ahmad Abouammo, 44, managed media partnerships in the Middle East and North Africa. He developed relationships with prominent individuals in the region, receiving hundreds of thousands of dollars and a luxury watch from a top adviser to Saudi Arabia’s crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman. In return, prosecutors said, he shared the personal user information of dissidents with Saudi officials. The jury convicted Mr. Abouammo of two counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud, two counts of money laundering, one count of falsifying records and one count of acting as an agent of a foreign government without properly disclosing that work. It found Mr. Abouammo not guilty on five counts of wire fraud or conspiracy to commit wire fraud.
- whywhywhydude 4y ago
  That is really scary. They probably have insiders in their payroll in every major tech company.
  - lesuorac 4y ago
    Why wouldn't they? If you had a budget of ~1T for several decades how would you (acting as MBS) spend it all?
  - Der_Einzige 4y ago
    I just assume that once you get into the FAANG caliber of compensation in the US tech industry (and possibly well before that), that suddenly the walls, and everything else starts listening and glowing.
justapassenger 4y ago
I didn't downvote the op. I downvoted you. Having someone to disagree with your stance doesn't mean there's a conspiracy.
jm4 4y ago
It’s probably because of the second paragraph. The first is a sentiment many people can agree with. The second paragraph, asserting not only that the U.S. is crumbling but that somehow retired generals working in SA is proof is utterly ridiculous.

jeanluc_discard 4y ago

Generals who oversaw Abu Ghraib are no different. Pax Americana is definitely crumbling before our eyes.

jdminhbg 4y ago
It's ok for two different things to both be bad, we don't have to pretend they're the same.
- sudosysgen 4y ago
  I don't see much of a difference between the two. They're both institutional murder and torture.
  - hey2022 4y ago
    There is action and there is the reaction. You could argue that the action is identical. But the reaction—internal, institutional, political—was and is not participating similar. People in power will abuse power. That’s inevitable in any regime. What makes the difference is how they are held accountable, especially by their own regime.
- googlryas 4y ago
  They're similar in that they're both beyond the pale. For example, Manadel al-Jamadi was murdered in detention, while being tortured by the US military. The people who murdered him then took "thumbs up" photos with his corpse. No one was punished for his murder. NSFW, his corpse is pictured on this page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Manadel_al-Jamadi https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Killing_of_Manadel_al-Jamadi

mbostleman 4y ago

Crumbling for sure. But incredible turn arounds have happened before. Consider the US posture at the end of the 1970s vs only a decade later.

jmyeet 4y ago

While I'm in general agreement that we should stop treating Saudi Arabia like it's the ally we want it to be given their actions in Yemen, with OPEC and their direct ties to 9/11. But your comment is particularly funny because you brought up NATO [1]: > One typical example is General Adolf Heusinger, a career military officer who, with the outbreak of the Second World War, became part of the German headquarters field staff and helped plan the Nazi invasions of Poland, Denmark, Norway, France and the Low Countries. The Nazis perpetrated against Poland one of the worst crimes history has ever known. Poland suffered the largest number of casualties per capita of any European country, with a total of about six million people killed. Heusinger rose quickly through the Wehrmacht’s administrative ranks and in 1944 was appointed Adolf Hitler’s Chief of the General Staff of the Army. > With the 1955 establishment of the Bundeswehr, the reconstituted West German Armed Forces, Heusinger returned to military service, and was appointed Lieutenant-General in 1955. In 1957, he was promoted to full general and named the first Inspector-General of the Bundeswehr. He served in that capacity until 1961. In 1961, Heusinger was appointed Chairman of the NATO Military Committee, making him the senior military spokesperson for NATO and in 1963 he also became NATO’s chief of staff, serving in that capacity until 1964. There were a number of other ex-Nazis in NATO's ranks and leadership. [1]: https://cpcml.ca/itn220328-tmld-art4/ https://cpcml.ca/itn220328-tmld-art4/

g8oz 4y ago

Under both Obama and Trump the US provided *direct* logistical and targeting support for the Saudi bombing of Yemeni targets. Biden finally stopped it in 2021. The humanitarian catastrophe in Yemen would not have happened without U.S acquiescence. Saudi Arabia is not a U.S adversary, it is an ungrateful client state and has been since Roosevelt.

mise_en_place 4y ago

> Pax americana is starting to crumble. You mean Pax Israel is starting to crumble. Is it a coincidence that Yair Lapid is now advocating for a two state solution? They see the writing on the wall.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]