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I did an ultra running race that took 37 hours last month. I got maybe 10minutes sleep. I had hallucinated before during (shorter) long races but I had no idea

I did an ultra running race that took 37 hours last month. I got maybe 10minutes sleep. I had hallucinated before during (shorter) long races but I had no idea that auditory hallucinations [1] were a thing. it was trippy "hearing" things for a solid 12 hours - mainly off-trail "voices" and the sound of "runners" approaching behind me. No matter how many times I stepped to the side to allow a non-existant runner go by, I kept doing it. It was that realistic [1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auditory_hallucination https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Auditory_hallucination

dtgriscom 4y ago
Some people would pay for that effect.
belval 4y ago
How do you rationalize running for 37 hours while having hallucinations, I am legitimately curious. At what point do you say "I might be pushing myself too much"?
- pb7 4y ago
  I’m not a runner but pushing yourself to your limits is the point of many sports. Humans like seeing how close they can get to death without succeeding.
- aliqot 4y ago
  Your body goes into an autopilot trance. It's happened to me on long bike marathons where as long as your water, electrolytes and fuels are still coming in your brain is in this primal mode where your body knows what to do, and your brain shuts off. You will hear conversations in memories vividly, or the 'singing' of the frame of the bicycle and its connection with the pavement through your tires becomes readily apparent. Later Hominids are meant for this. Without being able to pass long time chasing our prey to the moment of its exhaustion, we'd not have been able to secure the cholesterol needed to further evolve our brains.
  - jmnicolas 4y ago
    "exhaustion chase" never lasted that long, I don't remember the times exactly but animals that don't sweat are exhausted pretty quickly, a couple hours at most.
    - 988747 4y ago
      It took just 4 miles (approximately 40 minutes) to wear off some cheetahs: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-24953910 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-24953910 The hotter the weather, the easier this gets.
    - aliqot 4y ago
      and the effort to track these animals sometimes could take a long time and a lot of foot travel
    - jstarfish 4y ago
      Doesn't make any sense to me either. Not a biologist, but AFAIK animals known for being sprinters are able to outperform you in bursts, with refractory periods of extreme exhaustion and vulnerability. Especially if already wounded. You turn the chase into a game of hide-and-seek. Small fish/shrimp can appear to "teleport" since they dart away so quickly, but if you harass them enough, you exhaust them into a state of shock. It's no longer a chase, it's a harvest. Even in manhunting, you get nowhere chasing the subject since you move at the same speed and the element of uncertainty tilts in their favor. So you try to anticipate where they're going and ambush them there. You turn the chase into a trap. We're apex predators for a reason. Exhaustion chases don't make sense.
- paulette449 4y ago
  Well, I don't think it was a rational thing to do, but that's not a reason not to do it. The race [1] took place on circular hiking route 118 miles with 19,000ft of climbing. I'd hiked sections of the route (which typically takes 7-10 days for hikers) but was really drawn to the idea of doing the route in a "single day" (actually starts at 6am Friday, cut-off is 10pm Saturday - 40 hours). It was also my fourth time attempting to finish the race. After each of the first three times I failed, my immediate reaction was "It is too hard. I'm not going to sign up again." That is usually followed within 24-48 hours with an intense desire to sign up and try again. The hallucinations were not something I sought, and as I said, the auditory was not something I even know existed. The overall feeling was trippy rather than discomfort. Unlike the many blisters on my feet. I'm definitely older and chunkier than most doing the race I'm proud as hell that I persevered and finished especially after failing repeatedly. During the years of training and attempts I learned a lot about myself - good and bad. [1] - https://www.kerrywayultra.com/ https://www.kerrywayultra.com/
- yreg 4y ago
  Assuming it is safe (I don't know whether it is), it sounds like a fun experience.
circlingthesun 4y ago
I've never experienced auditory hallucinations before. I did however do a 42 hour self navigated run last year with 0 sleep. After about 30 hours I was visually hallucinating pretty much consistently. Amongst the things I saw was Darth Vader, a giant lego man, our cat sleeping on the trail, spectators that weren't there, a banker sitting at a desk staring at me, a church building that wasn't there, signs that didn't exist, and more. I think it has to do with the way the human visual system effectively does edge detection and then groups those into objects and attaches meaning. When you are extremely sleep deprived, the edges gets grouped differently and you start seeing things that aren't there. I could judge what was real or not based on likelihood of me seeing said things in the wilderness, or if I got close enough I would be able to tell what I was really looking at. Another runner later informed me that I had told him he wasn't real when he passed me.
- moistly 4y ago
  How do you stay on trail when you’re hallucinating signposts?
  - circlingthesun 4y ago
    GPS watch. Although I did accidentally run back where I came from for a bit O_o
    - moistly 4y ago
      Oof. You ultramarathoners need a watch that signals when you’re going backwards or in circles, like in a car racing game!
- jmnicolas 4y ago
  Why would you inflict that on yourself? I once saw death (exactly as most of us imagine it, dark robes and a scythe) while driving on a highway late at night, I understood the message my brain was sending me: I just took the next exit and slept for an hour (it was too cold to sleep longer, but it made a big difference on my concentration anyway).

dtgriscom 4y ago

Some people would pay for that effect.

belval 4y ago

How do you rationalize running for 37 hours while having hallucinations, I am legitimately curious. At what point do you say "I might be pushing myself too much"?

pb7 4y ago
I’m not a runner but pushing yourself to your limits is the point of many sports. Humans like seeing how close they can get to death without succeeding.
aliqot 4y ago
Your body goes into an autopilot trance. It's happened to me on long bike marathons where as long as your water, electrolytes and fuels are still coming in your brain is in this primal mode where your body knows what to do, and your brain shuts off. You will hear conversations in memories vividly, or the 'singing' of the frame of the bicycle and its connection with the pavement through your tires becomes readily apparent. Later Hominids are meant for this. Without being able to pass long time chasing our prey to the moment of its exhaustion, we'd not have been able to secure the cholesterol needed to further evolve our brains.
- jmnicolas 4y ago
  "exhaustion chase" never lasted that long, I don't remember the times exactly but animals that don't sweat are exhausted pretty quickly, a couple hours at most.
  - 988747 4y ago
    It took just 4 miles (approximately 40 minutes) to wear off some cheetahs: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-24953910 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-24953910 The hotter the weather, the easier this gets.
  - aliqot 4y ago
    and the effort to track these animals sometimes could take a long time and a lot of foot travel
  - jstarfish 4y ago
    Doesn't make any sense to me either. Not a biologist, but AFAIK animals known for being sprinters are able to outperform you in bursts, with refractory periods of extreme exhaustion and vulnerability. Especially if already wounded. You turn the chase into a game of hide-and-seek. Small fish/shrimp can appear to "teleport" since they dart away so quickly, but if you harass them enough, you exhaust them into a state of shock. It's no longer a chase, it's a harvest. Even in manhunting, you get nowhere chasing the subject since you move at the same speed and the element of uncertainty tilts in their favor. So you try to anticipate where they're going and ambush them there. You turn the chase into a trap. We're apex predators for a reason. Exhaustion chases don't make sense.
paulette449 4y ago
Well, I don't think it was a rational thing to do, but that's not a reason not to do it. The race [1] took place on circular hiking route 118 miles with 19,000ft of climbing. I'd hiked sections of the route (which typically takes 7-10 days for hikers) but was really drawn to the idea of doing the route in a "single day" (actually starts at 6am Friday, cut-off is 10pm Saturday - 40 hours). It was also my fourth time attempting to finish the race. After each of the first three times I failed, my immediate reaction was "It is too hard. I'm not going to sign up again." That is usually followed within 24-48 hours with an intense desire to sign up and try again. The hallucinations were not something I sought, and as I said, the auditory was not something I even know existed. The overall feeling was trippy rather than discomfort. Unlike the many blisters on my feet. I'm definitely older and chunkier than most doing the race I'm proud as hell that I persevered and finished especially after failing repeatedly. During the years of training and attempts I learned a lot about myself - good and bad. [1] - https://www.kerrywayultra.com/ https://www.kerrywayultra.com/
yreg 4y ago
Assuming it is safe (I don't know whether it is), it sounds like a fun experience.

circlingthesun 4y ago

I've never experienced auditory hallucinations before. I did however do a 42 hour self navigated run last year with 0 sleep. After about 30 hours I was visually hallucinating pretty much consistently. Amongst the things I saw was Darth Vader, a giant lego man, our cat sleeping on the trail, spectators that weren't there, a banker sitting at a desk staring at me, a church building that wasn't there, signs that didn't exist, and more. I think it has to do with the way the human visual system effectively does edge detection and then groups those into objects and attaches meaning. When you are extremely sleep deprived, the edges gets grouped differently and you start seeing things that aren't there. I could judge what was real or not based on likelihood of me seeing said things in the wilderness, or if I got close enough I would be able to tell what I was really looking at. Another runner later informed me that I had told him he wasn't real when he passed me.

moistly 4y ago
How do you stay on trail when you’re hallucinating signposts?
- circlingthesun 4y ago
  GPS watch. Although I did accidentally run back where I came from for a bit O_o
  - moistly 4y ago
    Oof. You ultramarathoners need a watch that signals when you’re going backwards or in circles, like in a car racing game!
jmnicolas 4y ago
Why would you inflict that on yourself? I once saw death (exactly as most of us imagine it, dark robes and a scythe) while driving on a highway late at night, I understood the message my brain was sending me: I just took the next exit and slept for an hour (it was too cold to sleep longer, but it made a big difference on my concentration anyway).