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Many, many places don't have that competition. Plenty of communities are at risk of losing their two local grocery stores and seeing them become just one. Groc

Many, many places don't have that competition. Plenty of communities are at risk of losing their two local grocery stores and seeing them become just one. Grocers are not evenly distributed, so while you are correct that at a national level there exists competition, it doesn't exist everywhere. And while a monoculture in an area might represent an opportunity for a grocery store to disrupt things, the people living in that monoculture gain no benefit from that opportunity - they have to live with the monoculture until someone maybe fixes the problem.

taylodl 4y ago
Even so, my understanding is there's not much overlap between Kroger and Albertsons so I'd expect their merger to have minimal impacts to local markets.
- function_seven 4y ago
  The last time this happened (Albertsons/Safeway), many of my local Albertsons locations were spun out to another company to appease regulators. That company failed almost immediately and Albertsons bought those locations back. In my area the chain grocers are now Albertsons and Kroger. That’s it. The regional chain is Stater Bros. I don’t know if Southern California is an anomaly or not though.
  - jdeibele 4y ago
    I was guessing that you were in Oregon or Washington because something similar happened here: a local chain (Haggen) tried to take over a bunch of stores and ended up in bankruptcy. Trying to take over 5X times as many stores as you were running before is a huge operational challenge. Haggen also alleged bad information from Albertson's. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haggen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haggen
    - function_seven 4y ago
      Nope. California, but yes it was Haggen. Thanks for reminding me of the name, I had forgotten it! I remember going there once and being gobsmacked at how expensive the place was. Like they were trying to charge Whole Foods prices for a regular grocery store. > Trying to take over 5X times as many stores as you were running before is a huge operational challenge. It reminded me of Frontier (tiny little telco) buying up a huge chunk of Verizon's wireline business in 2009. They still run it, but it's been rough. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier_Communications#Purchase_of_Verizon_lines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier_Communications#Purcha...
    - YLE118 4y ago
      The firm that owned Haggen paid for most of those stores by selling off most of the real estate and sticking the stores with rental payments. As I recall they expanded into CA, AZ, and NV before failing. I don't have a good timeline in my head but I remember they did a push to make the stores nicer, adding things like a wine bar. And then suddenly they were heading downhill. They had good produce, but I think some of that was turnover. Once the customers moved stores that went away.
- njovin 4y ago
  Anecdotally, there areas of my town (and adjacent towns) with a Kroger-owned store across the street from an Albertson's-owned store. I expect this merger will quickly result in the overlapping stores to be closed, those jobs to be lost and for the large empty retail space to negatively impact other adjacent businesses. This merger feels like it'll be bad for consumers and bad for the local economy of markets with overlap.
- colinmhayes 4y ago
  Only grocers in my gigantic city are Kroger, Albertsons, and Target(which basically no one uses as a pure grocer), plus boutique places like trader joes. We don't have walmart. Aldi is starting to move in, and Amazon has a couple whole foods and seems to be building more, but that's a few stores for millions of people. The vast majority of people only have Albertsons or Kroger within a reasonable distance.
  - taylodl 4y ago
    Millions of people are being served by three grocers? The metro area for my city is just shy of two million. We have Walmart, Kroger, Meijer, Giant Eagle, Target, Aldi, Trader Joe, Whole Foods, Marc's, IGA, Sam's Club, Costco, and Saraga (which is an international supermarket with every kind of produce from around the world) - not to mention all the specialty stores like the Mexican, Mediterranean, Indian, and Asian grocers. Almost all of these stores are within 5 miles of my house - the Costco is an outlier and the IGA is 6 miles away. I wonder how our cities came to be so different - especially when it sounds like yours is a larger city yet has fewer options?
sf_rob 4y ago
What I want to see is the the change in the percent of people who only have access to one brand umbrella of large grocery store crosstabbed against various distances (5,10,20 miles). Will this take the number of people with a single brand of grocery stores within 10 miles from 10% to 20% or 5% to 7%? I really have no idea.
- socialismisok 4y ago
  5 miles is a huge, huge area. Half a mile is probably more reasonable. Plenty of folks need to walk to their grocery store.

taylodl 4y ago

Even so, my understanding is there's not much overlap between Kroger and Albertsons so I'd expect their merger to have minimal impacts to local markets.

function_seven 4y ago
The last time this happened (Albertsons/Safeway), many of my local Albertsons locations were spun out to another company to appease regulators. That company failed almost immediately and Albertsons bought those locations back. In my area the chain grocers are now Albertsons and Kroger. That’s it. The regional chain is Stater Bros. I don’t know if Southern California is an anomaly or not though.
- jdeibele 4y ago
  I was guessing that you were in Oregon or Washington because something similar happened here: a local chain (Haggen) tried to take over a bunch of stores and ended up in bankruptcy. Trying to take over 5X times as many stores as you were running before is a huge operational challenge. Haggen also alleged bad information from Albertson's. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haggen https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haggen
  - function_seven 4y ago
    Nope. California, but yes it was Haggen. Thanks for reminding me of the name, I had forgotten it! I remember going there once and being gobsmacked at how expensive the place was. Like they were trying to charge Whole Foods prices for a regular grocery store. > Trying to take over 5X times as many stores as you were running before is a huge operational challenge. It reminded me of Frontier (tiny little telco) buying up a huge chunk of Verizon's wireline business in 2009. They still run it, but it's been rough. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier_Communications#Purchase_of_Verizon_lines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frontier_Communications#Purcha...
  - YLE118 4y ago
    The firm that owned Haggen paid for most of those stores by selling off most of the real estate and sticking the stores with rental payments. As I recall they expanded into CA, AZ, and NV before failing. I don't have a good timeline in my head but I remember they did a push to make the stores nicer, adding things like a wine bar. And then suddenly they were heading downhill. They had good produce, but I think some of that was turnover. Once the customers moved stores that went away.
njovin 4y ago
Anecdotally, there areas of my town (and adjacent towns) with a Kroger-owned store across the street from an Albertson's-owned store. I expect this merger will quickly result in the overlapping stores to be closed, those jobs to be lost and for the large empty retail space to negatively impact other adjacent businesses. This merger feels like it'll be bad for consumers and bad for the local economy of markets with overlap.
colinmhayes 4y ago
Only grocers in my gigantic city are Kroger, Albertsons, and Target(which basically no one uses as a pure grocer), plus boutique places like trader joes. We don't have walmart. Aldi is starting to move in, and Amazon has a couple whole foods and seems to be building more, but that's a few stores for millions of people. The vast majority of people only have Albertsons or Kroger within a reasonable distance.
- taylodl 4y ago
  Millions of people are being served by three grocers? The metro area for my city is just shy of two million. We have Walmart, Kroger, Meijer, Giant Eagle, Target, Aldi, Trader Joe, Whole Foods, Marc's, IGA, Sam's Club, Costco, and Saraga (which is an international supermarket with every kind of produce from around the world) - not to mention all the specialty stores like the Mexican, Mediterranean, Indian, and Asian grocers. Almost all of these stores are within 5 miles of my house - the Costco is an outlier and the IGA is 6 miles away. I wonder how our cities came to be so different - especially when it sounds like yours is a larger city yet has fewer options?

sf_rob 4y ago

What I want to see is the the change in the percent of people who only have access to one brand umbrella of large grocery store crosstabbed against various distances (5,10,20 miles). Will this take the number of people with a single brand of grocery stores within 10 miles from 10% to 20% or 5% to 7%? I really have no idea.

socialismisok 4y ago
5 miles is a huge, huge area. Half a mile is probably more reasonable. Plenty of folks need to walk to their grocery store.