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Does the article talk about the fact that so many universities stopped requiring the ACT or SAT for admissions? It sounded like this was a trend pre-COVID (beca

Does the article talk about the fact that so many universities stopped requiring the ACT or SAT for admissions? It sounded like this was a trend pre-COVID (because of the prevailing belief that standardized tests discriminated against minorities and poor people) and like many other things was accelerated by COVID when test-taking became impossible. This must have had some interesting effects.

temple_os 4y ago
Colleges are addicted to the new normal and will never go back. Applications surge by tens of thousands -> colleges make more of the $75 application fees. Acceptance rates go down -> your ranking in USNews goes up. Average ACT score increases (because why would you submit an under average score now) -> you can make your school look more prestigious than it actually is. Is any of this good for students? Standards can only continue to drop so low. Just look at Harvard. Since they don't require any additional essays applying there is now literally just a button press away - wouldn't you?
- riversflow 4y ago
  $75 was a lot of money to me when I was 17, and it still is.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- ryanhuff 4y ago
  I suspect the new normal of not requiring test scores has at least as much to do with university admissions feeling more free to mold their incoming classes without the pressure of maintaining a ranking stat (test scores).
  - lupire 4y ago
    What are they looking for in a student body? I never understood the pressure for highest SAT average. There are way more people with lower scores who want an education, and they don't want to go to a school where they have the lowest "aptitude" or preparation.
    - spoonjim 4y ago
      I want to play professional basketball with players of extremely high aptitude but I’m 5 foot 7 and can’t shoot or dribble. Somehow the Bulls aren’t interested in me
- lupire 4y ago
  Think about how time a value like 10K*$75 to a uni with a $50B+ endowment.
  - forgetbook 4y ago
    It's the difference between a revenue stream and a sum of assets under management. The $50B isn't liquid and can't be used to distribute bonuses. The yearly $75,000 however can be distributed among admissions office admin with impunity, for the labor of accepting file uploads.
  - Balgair 4y ago
    More applicants at the same number of acceptances makes the school literally more exclusive. They think that a smaller reported % makes them look better.
- gnicholas 4y ago
  > Acceptance rates go down -> your ranking in USNews goes up If everyone's acceptance rate went down, then no one's ranking went up.
  - temple_os 4y ago
    Right, but if everyone else starts doping and you're the only one who doesn't...
rayiner 4y ago
> because of the prevailing belief that standardized tests discriminated against minorities and poor people (if you define "minorities" to exclude the country's second largest, and fastest growing minority group)
- freeopinion 4y ago
  IIRC, Nevada posted the lowest average. (Nevada requires the ACT for high school graduation.) I define Nevadans as a minority in the U.S. It is obvious that this standardized test discriminates against this minority. Don't even get me started on people taller than two meters. ACT won't even show that data because it is so telling.
- warner25 4y ago
  Yeah, it's not my personal opinion, but this seemed to be the reason given publicly by various universities. The thread from last week showing that "Asian" kids' SAT scores crushed "White" kids' scores in Michigan was pretty eye-opening alongside the current Supreme Court cases regarding admissions and Asians. One of my favorite opinion pieces about the SAT, from a few years ago, came from a black guy who grew up in rural Mississippi or somewhere like that. He argued that the SAT was the only thing that gave him a level playing field, where he could prove his equivalence, in college admissions against kids from elite private schools and wealthy public school districts. His position made sense to me.

temple_os 4y ago

Colleges are addicted to the new normal and will never go back. Applications surge by tens of thousands -> colleges make more of the $75 application fees. Acceptance rates go down -> your ranking in USNews goes up. Average ACT score increases (because why would you submit an under average score now) -> you can make your school look more prestigious than it actually is. Is any of this good for students? Standards can only continue to drop so low. Just look at Harvard. Since they don't require any additional essays applying there is now literally just a button press away - wouldn't you?

riversflow 4y ago
$75 was a lot of money to me when I was 17, and it still is.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
ryanhuff 4y ago
I suspect the new normal of not requiring test scores has at least as much to do with university admissions feeling more free to mold their incoming classes without the pressure of maintaining a ranking stat (test scores).
- lupire 4y ago
  What are they looking for in a student body? I never understood the pressure for highest SAT average. There are way more people with lower scores who want an education, and they don't want to go to a school where they have the lowest "aptitude" or preparation.
  - spoonjim 4y ago
    I want to play professional basketball with players of extremely high aptitude but I’m 5 foot 7 and can’t shoot or dribble. Somehow the Bulls aren’t interested in me
lupire 4y ago
Think about how time a value like 10K*$75 to a uni with a $50B+ endowment.
- forgetbook 4y ago
  It's the difference between a revenue stream and a sum of assets under management. The $50B isn't liquid and can't be used to distribute bonuses. The yearly $75,000 however can be distributed among admissions office admin with impunity, for the labor of accepting file uploads.
- Balgair 4y ago
  More applicants at the same number of acceptances makes the school literally more exclusive. They think that a smaller reported % makes them look better.
gnicholas 4y ago
> Acceptance rates go down -> your ranking in USNews goes up If everyone's acceptance rate went down, then no one's ranking went up.
- temple_os 4y ago
  Right, but if everyone else starts doping and you're the only one who doesn't...

rayiner 4y ago

> because of the prevailing belief that standardized tests discriminated against minorities and poor people (if you define "minorities" to exclude the country's second largest, and fastest growing minority group)

freeopinion 4y ago
IIRC, Nevada posted the lowest average. (Nevada requires the ACT for high school graduation.) I define Nevadans as a minority in the U.S. It is obvious that this standardized test discriminates against this minority. Don't even get me started on people taller than two meters. ACT won't even show that data because it is so telling.
warner25 4y ago
Yeah, it's not my personal opinion, but this seemed to be the reason given publicly by various universities. The thread from last week showing that "Asian" kids' SAT scores crushed "White" kids' scores in Michigan was pretty eye-opening alongside the current Supreme Court cases regarding admissions and Asians. One of my favorite opinion pieces about the SAT, from a few years ago, came from a black guy who grew up in rural Mississippi or somewhere like that. He argued that the SAT was the only thing that gave him a level playing field, where he could prove his equivalence, in college admissions against kids from elite private schools and wealthy public school districts. His position made sense to me.