7 ms·

Look at Robbie Coltrane, who just died but had the gall to not completely disavow JK Rowling. Now people are celebrating his death.

lotsofpulp 4y ago
So? There are 8B+ people in the world. Some are going to have differing opinions.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
lapcat 4y ago
I haven't seen people celebrating his death. Anyway, this isn't an example of cancelation. You can't cancel a dead person. He wasn't killed by Twitter, he apparently died of illness.
- RHSeeger 4y ago
  I think the point was that people turned against him because he _didn't_ turn against someone else that was the target of cancelling. He wasn't cancelled, per se; but he did suffer negative consequences for it.
  - lapcat 4y ago
    > He wasn't cancelled, per se; but he did suffer negative consequences for it. What negative consequences, other than some people having a negative opinion of him? There's nothing inherently wrong with people having a negative opinion of another person, that happens all the time. It's not a phenomenon to be worried about.
    - deleted 4y ago
      [deleted]
    - Graziano_M 4y ago
      This is a dumb comment. Being socially outcast is terrible for your mental and physical health. And I wasn't saying he was canceled, I meant that he was bullied for 'defending' someone who was being bullied.
      - lapcat 4y ago
        > Being socially outcast is terrible for your mental and physical health. Yes, but Robbie Coltrane wasn't socially outcast. > I meant that he was bullied for 'defending' someone who was being bullied. Replaced "bullied" with "criticized". The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. And his mental and physical health seem ok for someone his age, or in any event, he doesn't appear to be suffering from feeling socially outcast. Being criticized is not the same thing as being canceled. It's not even close.
        Graziano_M 4y ago
        > Yes, but Robbie Coltrane wasn't socially outcast. Degrees on the same scale > Replaced "bullied" with "criticized". Criticized publicly and unfairly, I'll stick with bullied. > The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. I am sure he suffers from any amount of bullying and criticism he's receiving that he knows about.
        gremlinsinc 4y ago
        >> The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. > I am sure he suffers from any amount of bullying and criticism he's receiving that he knows about. Doubtful, given he's probably insulated from that because as a politician 100% of his career he's always had roughly 50% of the people against him give or take. Trump on the other hand couldn't take criticism because he wasn't a career politician, which would be a breath of fresh air honestly if it wasn't a rich narcissist at the wheel. Maybe a school teacher, or musician, hell even Tom Hanks. He got sucked into twitter wars, the current admin has a hotshot Twitter team that delivers blows but again keeps him insulated from it. That's the mark of a leader. I say this as someone who did NOT vote for Joe because I refuse to vote for an establishment candidate for the Presidential ticket, though I was relieved he won, for the sake of democracy and so we don't devolve into fascism. I was also glad Trump won though, not because I wanted anything he was selling but felt maybe having the crappiest timeline might push the left to the progressives if we fully just give up supporting them. It kinda worked. Overton window has shifted maybe 0.2 % but any give is good. I don't expect great things from Joe, not by a long shot. I long for the day that the presidential races are decided by ranked choice voting or similar systems. Then maybe we can get some good leaders from regular society who maybe could lead better than the rich bastards who run everything else. I mean it worked well for Ukraine, sure President Zelenskyy wasn't always the best, and had issues earlier in his Presidency, and such but he was a freaking actor and comedian, now he's a war hero and rightly so. The west gave him a ticket out, to escape and he stayed with his people to fight. That's pretty bold. You know none of our leaders on either side would be brave enough for that.
  - lotsofpulp 4y ago
    Specifically, what were the consequences or nature of Coltrane’s suffering?
- Kiro 4y ago
  > I haven't seen people celebrating his death. Strange comment. Just because you haven't seen it in your feed doesn't mean it isn't happening. https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/trans-activist-trolls-target-robbie-28243779 https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/tr...
  - lapcat 4y ago
    I didn't claim it never happened. I would claim that it's not the reaction of the vast majority of people.
  - unethical_ban 4y ago
    Having some trolls make bad comments that no one respects is not cancellation.
- paganel 4y ago
  > You can't cancel a dead person. You can certainly cancel his memory, which, for the people closed to said dead person, might matter a lot.
klyrs 4y ago
> Now people are celebrating his death. People grumbling about the views of a dead person is pretty damned harmless, isn't it? JK Rowling is "canceled" but she's still getting book and movie deals. Like Dave Chapelle, "cancelled" is a highly profitable status.
- gremlinsinc 4y ago
  Also these people make bank being in the public eye, the only power regular people have against them controlling every idea or creating negative movements is social media, a power we didn't have in the 80s and one that's often a two edge sword. The problem is people thinking they actually have a right or privilege to a platform, you don't and never did. Nobody had a 'platform' in the 80s, but now everybody thinks they're an internet celebrity if they have 1000+ followers. You're not, if you say something bad you should be rightfully held accountable for it. Any rich celebrity or business person like Elon Musk, could get shunned by all of society but they'd still do pretty good because of the money, pretty sure they won't cry too hard on their private jets.
- HKH2 4y ago
  > "cancelled" is a highly profitable status. Once you've made it, yes.
implements 4y ago
(In case it needs to be said) Not everyone believes JKR needs to disavowed. One of the problems with cancel culture is once someone has been cancelled the socially accepted and then unchallenged view of who are what they becomes over time an increasingly extreme caricature. JKR is just an unapologetic second-wave feminist, and that in itself is a socially and philosophically reasonable position to take (even if you don’t happen to agree with it).

lotsofpulp 4y ago

So? There are 8B+ people in the world. Some are going to have differing opinions.

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]

lapcat 4y ago

I haven't seen people celebrating his death. Anyway, this isn't an example of cancelation. You can't cancel a dead person. He wasn't killed by Twitter, he apparently died of illness.

RHSeeger 4y ago
I think the point was that people turned against him because he _didn't_ turn against someone else that was the target of cancelling. He wasn't cancelled, per se; but he did suffer negative consequences for it.
- lapcat 4y ago
  > He wasn't cancelled, per se; but he did suffer negative consequences for it. What negative consequences, other than some people having a negative opinion of him? There's nothing inherently wrong with people having a negative opinion of another person, that happens all the time. It's not a phenomenon to be worried about.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - Graziano_M 4y ago
    This is a dumb comment. Being socially outcast is terrible for your mental and physical health. And I wasn't saying he was canceled, I meant that he was bullied for 'defending' someone who was being bullied.
    - lapcat 4y ago
      > Being socially outcast is terrible for your mental and physical health. Yes, but Robbie Coltrane wasn't socially outcast. > I meant that he was bullied for 'defending' someone who was being bullied. Replaced "bullied" with "criticized". The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. And his mental and physical health seem ok for someone his age, or in any event, he doesn't appear to be suffering from feeling socially outcast. Being criticized is not the same thing as being canceled. It's not even close.
      - Graziano_M 4y ago
        > Yes, but Robbie Coltrane wasn't socially outcast. Degrees on the same scale > Replaced "bullied" with "criticized". Criticized publicly and unfairly, I'll stick with bullied. > The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. I am sure he suffers from any amount of bullying and criticism he's receiving that he knows about.
        gremlinsinc 4y ago
        >> The President of the United States is routinely and vehemently criticized. Hated by millions of people. And yet, he is not socially outcast. Nor is he bullied. > I am sure he suffers from any amount of bullying and criticism he's receiving that he knows about. Doubtful, given he's probably insulated from that because as a politician 100% of his career he's always had roughly 50% of the people against him give or take. Trump on the other hand couldn't take criticism because he wasn't a career politician, which would be a breath of fresh air honestly if it wasn't a rich narcissist at the wheel. Maybe a school teacher, or musician, hell even Tom Hanks. He got sucked into twitter wars, the current admin has a hotshot Twitter team that delivers blows but again keeps him insulated from it. That's the mark of a leader. I say this as someone who did NOT vote for Joe because I refuse to vote for an establishment candidate for the Presidential ticket, though I was relieved he won, for the sake of democracy and so we don't devolve into fascism. I was also glad Trump won though, not because I wanted anything he was selling but felt maybe having the crappiest timeline might push the left to the progressives if we fully just give up supporting them. It kinda worked. Overton window has shifted maybe 0.2 % but any give is good. I don't expect great things from Joe, not by a long shot. I long for the day that the presidential races are decided by ranked choice voting or similar systems. Then maybe we can get some good leaders from regular society who maybe could lead better than the rich bastards who run everything else. I mean it worked well for Ukraine, sure President Zelenskyy wasn't always the best, and had issues earlier in his Presidency, and such but he was a freaking actor and comedian, now he's a war hero and rightly so. The west gave him a ticket out, to escape and he stayed with his people to fight. That's pretty bold. You know none of our leaders on either side would be brave enough for that.
- lotsofpulp 4y ago
  Specifically, what were the consequences or nature of Coltrane’s suffering?
Kiro 4y ago
> I haven't seen people celebrating his death. Strange comment. Just because you haven't seen it in your feed doesn't mean it isn't happening. https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/trans-activist-trolls-target-robbie-28243779 https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/tr...
- lapcat 4y ago
  I didn't claim it never happened. I would claim that it's not the reaction of the vast majority of people.
- unethical_ban 4y ago
  Having some trolls make bad comments that no one respects is not cancellation.
paganel 4y ago
> You can't cancel a dead person. You can certainly cancel his memory, which, for the people closed to said dead person, might matter a lot.

klyrs 4y ago

> Now people are celebrating his death. People grumbling about the views of a dead person is pretty damned harmless, isn't it? JK Rowling is "canceled" but she's still getting book and movie deals. Like Dave Chapelle, "cancelled" is a highly profitable status.

gremlinsinc 4y ago
Also these people make bank being in the public eye, the only power regular people have against them controlling every idea or creating negative movements is social media, a power we didn't have in the 80s and one that's often a two edge sword. The problem is people thinking they actually have a right or privilege to a platform, you don't and never did. Nobody had a 'platform' in the 80s, but now everybody thinks they're an internet celebrity if they have 1000+ followers. You're not, if you say something bad you should be rightfully held accountable for it. Any rich celebrity or business person like Elon Musk, could get shunned by all of society but they'd still do pretty good because of the money, pretty sure they won't cry too hard on their private jets.
HKH2 4y ago
> "cancelled" is a highly profitable status. Once you've made it, yes.

implements 4y ago

(In case it needs to be said) Not everyone believes JKR needs to disavowed. One of the problems with cancel culture is once someone has been cancelled the socially accepted and then unchallenged view of who are what they becomes over time an increasingly extreme caricature. JKR is just an unapologetic second-wave feminist, and that in itself is a socially and philosophically reasonable position to take (even if you don’t happen to agree with it).