3 ms·

<facepalm> It isn’t simply economic. I don’t think you understand the fundamental purpose of an energy grid. It isn’t just a bunch of wires existing on their

<facepalm> It isn’t simply economic. I don’t think you understand the fundamental purpose of an energy grid. It isn’t just a bunch of wires existing on their own. It is the energy delivery infrastructure for all of society. “Baseload” is an attribute of the grid itself that indicates the minimum energy capacity these wires at present carry. Baseload is NOT a constant value or a constant consumption pattern across time of day/day of week alone. Baseload reflects the consumption of energy by society that the grid is DESIGNED to serve at any time. In other words, were one to use your definition, the grid would no longer be considered a functioning grid anymore but one that is broken since it is incapable of meeting its minimum design specifications.

Gwypaas 4y ago
I think you misunderstand "base load". What you are talking about is likely peak load, like the problem of everyone putting on their tea kettles during football pauses. [1] In the UK they went with pumped hydro ~50 years ago to solve this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_pickup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_pickup > The base load[1] (also baseload) is the __minimum__ level of demand on an electrical grid over a span of time https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_load https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_load It is a constant value. The rest used to be filled by peaker-plants or hydro. While slowly regulating the inflexible "base load" plants to follow the seasonal cycles. There is nothing inherent to this definition that it must be slow inflexible plants that provide it. More interesting discussions comes from how do you provide system strength, frequency regulation and so on when you decrease the synchronous components in the grid, because those are actual hard questions. For example, there is ongoing research in grid-forming inverters. This is what you do if you run your solar-powered home in island mode, and as anyone who has done it knows starting electrical engines sucks. It becomes a much more complex problem with destabilizing factors in continent-scale grids. https://www.pv-magazine.com/2022/08/29/grid-forming-inverter-to-stabilize-microgrids/ https://www.pv-magazine.com/2022/08/29/grid-forming-inverter...
- DisjointedHunt 4y ago
  You are conflating too many popular terms incorrectly while trying to make your point. Baseload as defined by Wikipedia that you cited does not contradict my point, you don’t seem to understand the nuance of what economic demand is and why that is different from an attribute or minimum design spec. It isn’t the consequence as you originally declared, it is an attribute of the grid itself. That’s a very important thing to understand. Anything can provide that input to the grid, but that means the source providing input to the grid must meet that very basic design specification. Flexibility of generation capacity coming online is easily compensated by other parts of the grid such as the storage or load shifting characteristics of the grid.

Gwypaas 4y ago

I think you misunderstand "base load". What you are talking about is likely peak load, like the problem of everyone putting on their tea kettles during football pauses. [1] In the UK they went with pumped hydro ~50 years ago to solve this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_pickup https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_pickup > The base load[1] (also baseload) is the __minimum__ level of demand on an electrical grid over a span of time https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_load https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Base_load It is a constant value. The rest used to be filled by peaker-plants or hydro. While slowly regulating the inflexible "base load" plants to follow the seasonal cycles. There is nothing inherent to this definition that it must be slow inflexible plants that provide it. More interesting discussions comes from how do you provide system strength, frequency regulation and so on when you decrease the synchronous components in the grid, because those are actual hard questions. For example, there is ongoing research in grid-forming inverters. This is what you do if you run your solar-powered home in island mode, and as anyone who has done it knows starting electrical engines sucks. It becomes a much more complex problem with destabilizing factors in continent-scale grids. https://www.pv-magazine.com/2022/08/29/grid-forming-inverter-to-stabilize-microgrids/ https://www.pv-magazine.com/2022/08/29/grid-forming-inverter...

DisjointedHunt 4y ago
You are conflating too many popular terms incorrectly while trying to make your point. Baseload as defined by Wikipedia that you cited does not contradict my point, you don’t seem to understand the nuance of what economic demand is and why that is different from an attribute or minimum design spec. It isn’t the consequence as you originally declared, it is an attribute of the grid itself. That’s a very important thing to understand. Anything can provide that input to the grid, but that means the source providing input to the grid must meet that very basic design specification. Flexibility of generation capacity coming online is easily compensated by other parts of the grid such as the storage or load shifting characteristics of the grid.