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"I think they should be preparing a for a huge postwar assistance, not just money for rebuilding, but psychological / therapy based on their experience to try t

"I think they should be preparing a for a huge postwar assistance, not just money for rebuilding, but psychological / therapy based on their experience to try to reduce the effects of wartime trauma on Ukraine. " We take lots of refugees. I would argue this is already a very effective way of preventing further traumatizing. But as far as I am aware, those who come do not easily get offered psychatric help, even if they already are traumatized. But the psychatric sector is pretty much operating on its limits anyway.

gumby 4y ago
Being a refugee is traumatic on its own. But Germany has a lot of lessons (including what not to do) that it could be providing for good.
- usrusr 4y ago
  I don't think that Germany has many lessons: our hindsight about the first decades after the war time is completely dominated by the the topic of denazification, in all its twists and details, that everything else just happened without anybody really taking note.
  - gumby 4y ago
    I can tell you it’s still a big issue in the Dörfer which were likely less subject to the denazification process. Our parents’ generation (those who were kids in the 30s & 40s) are mostly gone but those born in the 50s-70s are still around and many in therapy which was not common before. That is the pool to learn from. There is sadly no shortage of countries with large populations who suffered in war. But Germany is a large, wealthy country which is a good example of what Ukraine will face in postwar reconstruction. And yes, Germany still owes an old debt to Ukraine (instigation of war) as well as a contemporary one (holding off Russia with limited German assistance).
Schiendelman 4y ago
The psychiatric sector should be quadrupled. More so in some countries. It’s flabbergasting to me that people don’t see it as - not just a moral imperative - but also an obvious economic one.
- chaostheory 4y ago
  Who’s going to pay for it? Health insurers are still trying to avoid it. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/567264925/health-insurers-are-still-skimping-on-mental-health-coverage https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/5672649... https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/06/07/730404539/mental-health-parity-is-still-an-elusive-goal-in-u-s-insurance-coverage https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/06/07/7304045...
  - gumby 4y ago
    That’s like saying “who will pay for clean power” or “who will pay for firefighters?” or. “Who can afford to pay for safer building codes?” In the long term we all benefit.
    - chaostheory 4y ago
      Yes, but someone has to be willing to pay for it. I'm not wrong.
      - dflock 4y ago
        In a national/publicly funded national health system, that system (i.e., taxpayers) should fund it, because better mental health in the population will improve the economic performance of the nation, increasing tax receipts etc... That is, if they can get over that calvinist/puritan mental health == weakness/stigma thing, which seems to be slowly happening.
        chaostheory 4y ago
        I agree that it should be funded. I’m just pointing out that even places like Canada don’t fund it

gumby 4y ago

Being a refugee is traumatic on its own. But Germany has a lot of lessons (including what not to do) that it could be providing for good.

usrusr 4y ago
I don't think that Germany has many lessons: our hindsight about the first decades after the war time is completely dominated by the the topic of denazification, in all its twists and details, that everything else just happened without anybody really taking note.
- gumby 4y ago
  I can tell you it’s still a big issue in the Dörfer which were likely less subject to the denazification process. Our parents’ generation (those who were kids in the 30s & 40s) are mostly gone but those born in the 50s-70s are still around and many in therapy which was not common before. That is the pool to learn from. There is sadly no shortage of countries with large populations who suffered in war. But Germany is a large, wealthy country which is a good example of what Ukraine will face in postwar reconstruction. And yes, Germany still owes an old debt to Ukraine (instigation of war) as well as a contemporary one (holding off Russia with limited German assistance).

Schiendelman 4y ago

The psychiatric sector should be quadrupled. More so in some countries. It’s flabbergasting to me that people don’t see it as - not just a moral imperative - but also an obvious economic one.

chaostheory 4y ago
Who’s going to pay for it? Health insurers are still trying to avoid it. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/567264925/health-insurers-are-still-skimping-on-mental-health-coverage https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2017/11/29/5672649... https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/06/07/730404539/mental-health-parity-is-still-an-elusive-goal-in-u-s-insurance-coverage https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/06/07/7304045...
- gumby 4y ago
  That’s like saying “who will pay for clean power” or “who will pay for firefighters?” or. “Who can afford to pay for safer building codes?” In the long term we all benefit.
  - chaostheory 4y ago
    Yes, but someone has to be willing to pay for it. I'm not wrong.
    - dflock 4y ago
      In a national/publicly funded national health system, that system (i.e., taxpayers) should fund it, because better mental health in the population will improve the economic performance of the nation, increasing tax receipts etc... That is, if they can get over that calvinist/puritan mental health == weakness/stigma thing, which seems to be slowly happening.
      - chaostheory 4y ago
        I agree that it should be funded. I’m just pointing out that even places like Canada don’t fund it