8 ms·

Oracle lays off more than 200 California-based workers

119 points by kungfudoi 4y ago

deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
m0llusk 4y ago
Oracle seems to be optimized for profit. Maybe the workers should unionize.
- GoldenMonkey 4y ago
  it’s not like they’re hourly shift workers. plenty of high tech salaries.
  - 1letterunixname 4y ago
    All workers should unionize. There is no need to punch down or be classist in any direction. Know how the 40 hour work week became a thing, paid time off, etc.? Collective action by workers. Employee-owned co-ops are actually the fairest structures for workers of all sorts. If you're not an owner, then you're the product, being cheated, and at the mercy of the corporation to fire or replace you at any time.
    - emidln 4y ago
      > Know how the 40 hour work week became a thing, paid time off, etc.? Collective action by workers. In the US? Armed revolt by unionized workers. Blood baths on both sides (labor and hired scabs/private police/paramilitary). Forced bargaining from state and federal governments. If you know where to look, there are little "union" cemeteries dotted across the Eastern and Midwestern US where union folk are buried due to company town cemeteries banning strikers and their families from being buried "in town". Workers' rights were bought and paid for in blood.
      - yellowapple 4y ago
        > In the US? Armed revolt by unionized workers. And folks wonder why I oppose gun control.
        1letterunixname 4y ago
        The key is the kind of gun control. I don't want kids having gatling guns, drunks shooting off their pistols on New Year's in city limits, neighbors owning live grenades, or criminals packing SMGs. I do want every sane, stable, decent, responsible adult conceal carrying to be able to defend their life and others against the threat of mass shooters and random crazies. When seconds matter, help is only minutes-hours away and can file a report about it. Weapons-free areas require there to be official continuous security to fill the void, otherwise it presents a security risk to those who follow the rules. (And I'm no MAGA, I'm a pinko commie.) If the US started as "gun-free", gun control would be possible but there are just too many guns out there to where the "nuclear genie" is out the bottle and can't be easily put back in.
      - 1letterunixname 4y ago
        Don't conflate or equivocate the two. I recall reading of an incident were Pinkertons sat in the comfort of sniper nests and shot down picketing miners as fast as they could shoot. The sort of thing you hear about in the most oppressive regimes or during periods of colonial rule. The Bonus Army. Douglas MacArthur and George S. Patton attacked veterans, their wives, and children with tanks and live ammunition. Similar violence occurred against Occupy Wall Street. Most people don't remember, or were never taught, that Oklahoma was a bastion of socialist thought and movements until it was obliterated. Bernie Sanders is a modern day Henry A. Wallace and suffered a similar fate.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- knorker 4y ago
  Basically all companies are optimized for profit.
  - dijit 4y ago
    Technically correct. There is a difference, though, between maximising profit and delivering value for everyone. A corner store is technically optimising for profit, but they also ensure value so that you don't go elsewhere. Oracle does more of the former, they maximise profit above what the value is. You could ask then "Who are there customers, surely someone has value", which is a valid claim but I would put hard money on: a lot of Oracle customers used to have value but are now just being squeezed hard. Maybe a minority actually get a good value out of them though.
    - yellowapple 4y ago
      A lot of startups use Netsuite and get squeezed hard for it, and a lot of enterprises use Oracle DB and get squeezed hard for it. Oracle doesn't need to "ensure value" to prevent you from going elsewhere; vendor lock-in works just fine.
1-6 4y ago
- mikeyouse 4y ago
  I mean, that was an exceptionally dirty deal that should definitely be brought up every time Oracle is in the news.
- dartharva 4y ago
  *Ex-President Trump
  - collegeburner 4y ago
    its common practice to refer to presidents with that title: carter, bush and obama you all hear the same.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
wcfields 4y ago
Timing is right before their largest conference in Las Vegas next week on the 17th, Cloud World[1] [1] https://www.oracle.com/cloudworld/ https://www.oracle.com/cloudworld/
- systemvoltage 4y ago
  Every single person hates Oracle to death on HN and elsewhere, so I should probably do the exact opposite and try to see what cool new things they're doing. I dabbled in their cloud offerings (hey, free arm core instances) and everything looks super polished and excellent. Pricing is fair, interface is way better than AWS. I am tempted to tune into Cloud World. Anyone got any positive things to say about Oracle? What cool things are they doing?
  - KptMarchewa 4y ago
    Their stewardship of Java is great. I have high confidence that both language and runtime will evolve in direction useful to giant majority of Java devs.
  - deleted 4y ago
    [deleted]
  - AmericanChopper 4y ago
    Their RDBMS is an amazing product. There’s reasons you might _prefer_ SQL Server, or reasons you might need something more specialized, and the open source alternatives are really quite good as well. But I’ve always loved their RDBMS technology. None of the reasons that I hate Oracle relate to the quality of their products.
    - systemvoltage 4y ago
      That reminds me of this hilarious comment of 25 million lines of code in Oracle DB: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941
bfung 4y ago
The article says “201” - yes, technically more than 200. Other articles says “hundreds of jobs”. Keep in mind Oracle is a 140,000 to 170,000 large company, so this is a 0.14% reduction, compared to other tech companies planning to cut 10s of percents. Compare that to others: Docusign: ~670 Intel: ~ planning to layoff thousands Twilio: 800-900 (~11% cut) There’s a lot of sensationalism in reporting here.
- buscoquadnary 4y ago
  You got it all wrong man. Oracle only has 205 engineers, so this is devestating to their workforce. Everyone else at Oracle is either in legal or a proctologist.
  - romeoblade 4y ago
    > Everyone else at Oracle is either in legal or a proctologist. Lmao. Man you don't know how much I needed to laugh that hard after the last few weeks I had. Thank you.
  - smarks 4y ago
    I know, right? When Oracle bought Sun they forced all the engineers to choose between legal and proctology; I chose the latter. After ten years I’m starting to regret my decision. At least Sun wasn’t bought by IBM. (That was actually in play before the Oracle deal.) At IBM they force the engineers to go into Sales. That would have been far, far worse.
    - aardvark179 4y ago
      I’ll buy you a beer at the next JVMLS for each proctology joke you can smuggle into a non draft JEP. :-)
      - testmasterflex 4y ago
        Dying here. Is this a meme I’ve missed?
soared 4y ago
Oracle lays off a lot more than that every March-ish and September-ish, this is not an indicator of recession/etc.
nopenopenopeno 4y ago
IIRC Oracle is also in the process of opening new offices in Guadalajara, Mexico.
ohiovr 4y ago
Hopefully we can get this story to 201 points. One for each worker.
- yellowapple 4y ago
  At that point it should be converted into an epic.
not_enoch_wise 4y ago
No lawyers were harmed in the execution of this restructuring.
effnorwood 4y ago
cbm-vic-20 4y ago
I worked at Oracle for many years. Oracle has a lot of very talented engineers, of all levels of experience, all over the world. Lots of less-talented ones too, but that's not the point. The problem is those talented engineers are often suppressed by upper management who don't recognize that value that those engineers bring, in favor of their own pet projects. Every once in a while, there's a group that doesn't run into this: the Java team is one of them. OCI is better than people give it credit for, but all that is overshadowed by the dumb decisions made by VP-and-above management.
metadat 4y ago
How many of these were engineers, though? "Workers" is pretty meaningless.

119 points by kungfudoi 4y ago

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

m0llusk 4y ago

Oracle seems to be optimized for profit. Maybe the workers should unionize.

GoldenMonkey 4y ago
it’s not like they’re hourly shift workers. plenty of high tech salaries.
- 1letterunixname 4y ago
  All workers should unionize. There is no need to punch down or be classist in any direction. Know how the 40 hour work week became a thing, paid time off, etc.? Collective action by workers. Employee-owned co-ops are actually the fairest structures for workers of all sorts. If you're not an owner, then you're the product, being cheated, and at the mercy of the corporation to fire or replace you at any time.
  - emidln 4y ago
    > Know how the 40 hour work week became a thing, paid time off, etc.? Collective action by workers. In the US? Armed revolt by unionized workers. Blood baths on both sides (labor and hired scabs/private police/paramilitary). Forced bargaining from state and federal governments. If you know where to look, there are little "union" cemeteries dotted across the Eastern and Midwestern US where union folk are buried due to company town cemeteries banning strikers and their families from being buried "in town". Workers' rights were bought and paid for in blood.
    - yellowapple 4y ago
      > In the US? Armed revolt by unionized workers. And folks wonder why I oppose gun control.
      - 1letterunixname 4y ago
        The key is the kind of gun control. I don't want kids having gatling guns, drunks shooting off their pistols on New Year's in city limits, neighbors owning live grenades, or criminals packing SMGs. I do want every sane, stable, decent, responsible adult conceal carrying to be able to defend their life and others against the threat of mass shooters and random crazies. When seconds matter, help is only minutes-hours away and can file a report about it. Weapons-free areas require there to be official continuous security to fill the void, otherwise it presents a security risk to those who follow the rules. (And I'm no MAGA, I'm a pinko commie.) If the US started as "gun-free", gun control would be possible but there are just too many guns out there to where the "nuclear genie" is out the bottle and can't be easily put back in.
    - 1letterunixname 4y ago
      Don't conflate or equivocate the two. I recall reading of an incident were Pinkertons sat in the comfort of sniper nests and shot down picketing miners as fast as they could shoot. The sort of thing you hear about in the most oppressive regimes or during periods of colonial rule. The Bonus Army. Douglas MacArthur and George S. Patton attacked veterans, their wives, and children with tanks and live ammunition. Similar violence occurred against Occupy Wall Street. Most people don't remember, or were never taught, that Oklahoma was a bastion of socialist thought and movements until it was obliterated. Bernie Sanders is a modern day Henry A. Wallace and suffered a similar fate.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
knorker 4y ago
Basically all companies are optimized for profit.
- dijit 4y ago
  Technically correct. There is a difference, though, between maximising profit and delivering value for everyone. A corner store is technically optimising for profit, but they also ensure value so that you don't go elsewhere. Oracle does more of the former, they maximise profit above what the value is. You could ask then "Who are there customers, surely someone has value", which is a valid claim but I would put hard money on: a lot of Oracle customers used to have value but are now just being squeezed hard. Maybe a minority actually get a good value out of them though.
  - yellowapple 4y ago
    A lot of startups use Netsuite and get squeezed hard for it, and a lot of enterprises use Oracle DB and get squeezed hard for it. Oracle doesn't need to "ensure value" to prevent you from going elsewhere; vendor lock-in works just fine.

1-6 4y ago

mikeyouse 4y ago
I mean, that was an exceptionally dirty deal that should definitely be brought up every time Oracle is in the news.
dartharva 4y ago
*Ex-President Trump
- collegeburner 4y ago
  its common practice to refer to presidents with that title: carter, bush and obama you all hear the same.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

wcfields 4y ago

Timing is right before their largest conference in Las Vegas next week on the 17th, Cloud World[1] [1] https://www.oracle.com/cloudworld/ https://www.oracle.com/cloudworld/

systemvoltage 4y ago
Every single person hates Oracle to death on HN and elsewhere, so I should probably do the exact opposite and try to see what cool new things they're doing. I dabbled in their cloud offerings (hey, free arm core instances) and everything looks super polished and excellent. Pricing is fair, interface is way better than AWS. I am tempted to tune into Cloud World. Anyone got any positive things to say about Oracle? What cool things are they doing?
- KptMarchewa 4y ago
  Their stewardship of Java is great. I have high confidence that both language and runtime will evolve in direction useful to giant majority of Java devs.
- deleted 4y ago
  [deleted]
- AmericanChopper 4y ago
  Their RDBMS is an amazing product. There’s reasons you might _prefer_ SQL Server, or reasons you might need something more specialized, and the open source alternatives are really quite good as well. But I’ve always loved their RDBMS technology. None of the reasons that I hate Oracle relate to the quality of their products.
  - systemvoltage 4y ago
    That reminds me of this hilarious comment of 25 million lines of code in Oracle DB: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18442941

bfung 4y ago

The article says “201” - yes, technically more than 200. Other articles says “hundreds of jobs”. Keep in mind Oracle is a 140,000 to 170,000 large company, so this is a 0.14% reduction, compared to other tech companies planning to cut 10s of percents. Compare that to others: Docusign: ~670 Intel: ~ planning to layoff thousands Twilio: 800-900 (~11% cut) There’s a lot of sensationalism in reporting here.

buscoquadnary 4y ago
You got it all wrong man. Oracle only has 205 engineers, so this is devestating to their workforce. Everyone else at Oracle is either in legal or a proctologist.
- romeoblade 4y ago
  > Everyone else at Oracle is either in legal or a proctologist. Lmao. Man you don't know how much I needed to laugh that hard after the last few weeks I had. Thank you.
- smarks 4y ago
  I know, right? When Oracle bought Sun they forced all the engineers to choose between legal and proctology; I chose the latter. After ten years I’m starting to regret my decision. At least Sun wasn’t bought by IBM. (That was actually in play before the Oracle deal.) At IBM they force the engineers to go into Sales. That would have been far, far worse.
  - aardvark179 4y ago
    I’ll buy you a beer at the next JVMLS for each proctology joke you can smuggle into a non draft JEP. :-)
    - testmasterflex 4y ago
      Dying here. Is this a meme I’ve missed?

soared 4y ago

Oracle lays off a lot more than that every March-ish and September-ish, this is not an indicator of recession/etc.

nopenopenopeno 4y ago

IIRC Oracle is also in the process of opening new offices in Guadalajara, Mexico.

ohiovr 4y ago

Hopefully we can get this story to 201 points. One for each worker.

yellowapple 4y ago
At that point it should be converted into an epic.

not_enoch_wise 4y ago

No lawyers were harmed in the execution of this restructuring.

effnorwood 4y ago

cbm-vic-20 4y ago

I worked at Oracle for many years. Oracle has a lot of very talented engineers, of all levels of experience, all over the world. Lots of less-talented ones too, but that's not the point. The problem is those talented engineers are often suppressed by upper management who don't recognize that value that those engineers bring, in favor of their own pet projects. Every once in a while, there's a group that doesn't run into this: the Java team is one of them. OCI is better than people give it credit for, but all that is overshadowed by the dumb decisions made by VP-and-above management.

metadat 4y ago

How many of these were engineers, though? "Workers" is pretty meaningless.