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Elitist?? I doubt that any American family has a lower standard of living, than a Soviet math post-graduate student, single mother of two. We have no permanent

Elitist?? I doubt that any American family has a lower standard of living, than a Soviet math post-graduate student, single mother of two. We have no permanent beds only folding ones, I made my studies on a drawing board put over a sewing machine (do you know what sewing machine is for? It’s to repair your old clothing) our apartment was shared by two families, it has no hot water and water itself was de facto rationed. In elementary school - while my mother was on the field trips gathering data for her PhD thesis on methan gas distribution in coal mines of Donbass region I was living with my mathematician granddad. It was a small house shared by three families, no running water and amenities inside. My grandparents grew their own vegetables since you can’t buy vegetables on the market (since there were no market), and even bread was rationed - it was Khrushchev time. Elitist family, indeed. Btw my ancestors were slaves, freed about the same time American slaves were freed. And then communists killed a brother of granddad, and a father of my stepfather, and then national-socialists killed the only brother of my mother, my uncle. My stepfather was never allowed to college, as a son of the “enemy of the people”. If you want to see “elitist” - look at any American house.

bumby 4y ago
You might not know the wide variability in American standards of living. I had a SO who did not experience much luxury growing up. They had to run an extension cord from a charitable neighbor to have electricity to do their homework. It wasn't uncommon for them to sleep bundled up in winter clothes together in the living room because they had no heat. I understand television may give a false impression of the American lifestyle, but there's a wide range of experience in a country approaching 400MM people.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
selimthegrim 4y ago
Come to New Orleans and after I am done giving you tour of some neighborhoods let's see what you say.
- MikePlacid 4y ago
  As one Indian professor I don’t know said to a Russian-Mexican professor I do know while the latter was giving the former a tour on some unhappy parts of Mexico City: “You want to surprise me with poverty? Look, everyone here has shoes”. Our company moved to San Francisco in late 90s to save money before IPO. The location was right near Tenderloin, the murder capital of the US. I walked through it from time to time. Nothing special, a city like a city. I remember thinking: how nice it is to walk through American streets - so less aggression in the air… There was a huge homeless camp though near Civic Center. There was a homeless man sleeping near a back door to our office, he once saved a girl patronizing a local bar from rape. In Soviet Union these homeless would have been rounded up and moved to some rural location not near than 100 km to any big city. Some could have been criminally tried even, like “elitist” Soviet poet Brodsky who was tried and convicted for a lack of permanent job. “Elitist” who can be tried and convicted any time authorities do not like something he says? (I kinda worried that Americans do not feel that personal freedoms had much value, and are willing to trade them for some fashionable illusion). But I can agree that there can be found some Americans who are materially worse than our family was. Still, calling us elitists - is a sign of laughable ignorance of the world at large.
  - selimthegrim 4y ago
    Quite frankly after what Brodsky said about Ukrainians I’m not feeling much sympathy for him - even if it was in response to historical anti-Semitism
BaseballPhysics 4y ago
There may be a language issue here, but to be clear: Elitist != rich. I've run across many poorer folks who harbour elitist attitudes (like, say, ascribing mental or moral failings to folks who choose to indulge in sex, drugs, or alcohol).
- MikePlacid 4y ago
  There easily can be a language issue here, but I believe the only negative word I used was “defect” and I’ve applied it to myself, not to my classmates who chose to indulge in these wonderful things you’ve listed. Sex is indeed wonderful. Alcohol also gives you some pleasant feelings. I do not get nicotine at all but people seem to enjoy it, who am I to disagree. Note that indulging in all these pleasant activities does not prevent you from being successful. A lot of my heavily drinking classmates became rather accomplished. We have a head of a regional KGB office (our region is about 2 mln people, a dozen counties or so), a head of regional sanitary office (a medic who checks business medical safety compliance), doctors, engineers… And if I was born say a hundred years earlier there would be no such a crazy demand for computer specialists, and I would have probably landed a job of math teacher at high school, or if I was lucky - at community college like my granddad. Math teacher at high school - only some brain defect can lead you to give up pleasures of booze to get such a job, no?
ziddoap 4y ago
>(do you know what sewing machine is for? It’s to repair your old clothing) Do you find these condescending tactics work well when you're trying to change someone's view?

bumby 4y ago

You might not know the wide variability in American standards of living. I had a SO who did not experience much luxury growing up. They had to run an extension cord from a charitable neighbor to have electricity to do their homework. It wasn't uncommon for them to sleep bundled up in winter clothes together in the living room because they had no heat. I understand television may give a false impression of the American lifestyle, but there's a wide range of experience in a country approaching 400MM people.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

selimthegrim 4y ago

Come to New Orleans and after I am done giving you tour of some neighborhoods let's see what you say.

MikePlacid 4y ago
As one Indian professor I don’t know said to a Russian-Mexican professor I do know while the latter was giving the former a tour on some unhappy parts of Mexico City: “You want to surprise me with poverty? Look, everyone here has shoes”. Our company moved to San Francisco in late 90s to save money before IPO. The location was right near Tenderloin, the murder capital of the US. I walked through it from time to time. Nothing special, a city like a city. I remember thinking: how nice it is to walk through American streets - so less aggression in the air… There was a huge homeless camp though near Civic Center. There was a homeless man sleeping near a back door to our office, he once saved a girl patronizing a local bar from rape. In Soviet Union these homeless would have been rounded up and moved to some rural location not near than 100 km to any big city. Some could have been criminally tried even, like “elitist” Soviet poet Brodsky who was tried and convicted for a lack of permanent job. “Elitist” who can be tried and convicted any time authorities do not like something he says? (I kinda worried that Americans do not feel that personal freedoms had much value, and are willing to trade them for some fashionable illusion). But I can agree that there can be found some Americans who are materially worse than our family was. Still, calling us elitists - is a sign of laughable ignorance of the world at large.
- selimthegrim 4y ago
  Quite frankly after what Brodsky said about Ukrainians I’m not feeling much sympathy for him - even if it was in response to historical anti-Semitism

BaseballPhysics 4y ago

There may be a language issue here, but to be clear: Elitist != rich. I've run across many poorer folks who harbour elitist attitudes (like, say, ascribing mental or moral failings to folks who choose to indulge in sex, drugs, or alcohol).

MikePlacid 4y ago
There easily can be a language issue here, but I believe the only negative word I used was “defect” and I’ve applied it to myself, not to my classmates who chose to indulge in these wonderful things you’ve listed. Sex is indeed wonderful. Alcohol also gives you some pleasant feelings. I do not get nicotine at all but people seem to enjoy it, who am I to disagree. Note that indulging in all these pleasant activities does not prevent you from being successful. A lot of my heavily drinking classmates became rather accomplished. We have a head of a regional KGB office (our region is about 2 mln people, a dozen counties or so), a head of regional sanitary office (a medic who checks business medical safety compliance), doctors, engineers… And if I was born say a hundred years earlier there would be no such a crazy demand for computer specialists, and I would have probably landed a job of math teacher at high school, or if I was lucky - at community college like my granddad. Math teacher at high school - only some brain defect can lead you to give up pleasures of booze to get such a job, no?

ziddoap 4y ago

>(do you know what sewing machine is for? It’s to repair your old clothing) Do you find these condescending tactics work well when you're trying to change someone's view?