Unfortunately it often happens that, even when people lurk for a while, and humor the experts and do the work to show why they really want to talk about X and n

Unfortunately it often happens that, even when people lurk for a while, and humor the experts and do the work to show why they really want to talk about X and not Y, they are still shut out. Part of this is tribal - you are an outsider by definition, and you challenged the experts and their dogma, you will now be punished for it no matter how valid your position is. And so you move on and do other things, and the culture of grumpy rigid experts perpetuates itself.