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Isn’t that just the definition of network effect? Meta is clearly betting that at a certain critical mass not owning a VR headset in a professional environment

Isn’t that just the definition of network effect? Meta is clearly betting that at a certain critical mass not owning a VR headset in a professional environment will be like not owning a webcam.

jonny_eh 4y ago
How do I bet that they're wrong?
- weeblewobble 4y ago
  short $META?
spywaregorilla 4y ago
I think it will come across as unprofessional to join a meeting in vr personally. And triply so if not everyone, or everyone of a certain class is doing it. VR is goofy, and it'll continue to be goofy. Like... ok so you have an avatar. Are a cartoon? That's a bad start. Are they maybe an unreal meta human that looks like you? Different than you? Like you, but poorly done? Ok whatever let's assume the rendering is fine. What are you doing in this virtual meeting? Are you standing? Because that would be very weird for a business meeting. Presumably you're sitting irl because this is work, so maybe your avatar is sitting... Do they have a table in the virtual room? Because a meeting with no table is a bit odd for a business setting. But if you're in VR, you probably don't have a table in front of you irl. Or at least not the same table that's virtually in front of you. What does your body language track? What if Carol starts lagging and her avatar starts jerking around? What if your facial tracking gets something wrong and you just have a weird look on your face? Or more realistically your facial tracking is just a pretty simplistic thing that vacillates between neutral and smiling and you need to convey negative emotions? In snow crash, the thing that made the metaverse work was very strong facial expression mimicry. It's not a terrible argument, but we don't have that. We have fake expressive facial mimicry that looks emotive but isn't actually that nuanced to your own face. VR Chat for business just seems like a preposterous idea. Especially for older folks.
- cwalv 4y ago
  Remote work in general seems like a preposterous idea many folks .. even after being forced to do it, they can't really wrap their head around how it works, or why some people like it
- onion2k 4y ago
  VR Chat for business just seems like a preposterous idea. Especially for older folks. What this usually means is that startups and 'cool' companies adopt it, and then companies run by older people adopt it because they cargo cult anything successful. That could be enough to drive it to the mainstream. It's worked for lots of other tech and ideas (websites, mobile apps, nosql, agile, etc).
kortilla 4y ago
That’s a pretty weak bet given that owning a webcam isn’t even expected for meetings between businesses.
yamtaddle 4y ago
A few years ago when video chat was, if you asked tech workers, already the norm for remote meetings, I know for a fact that at least one of the big three management consulting firms still strongly preferred call-an-actual-phone-number voice conferencing. It struck me as goofy at first but I think they had it right, actually. You can join a call like that from almost anywhere. Don't need to dig out a laptop, let alone VR garbage. Airport, walking down the street on the way to another meeting, in the car on speakerphone (like, probably don't do this, but of course tons of people do), whatever, it all works. No "do I have the service they want installed? Is it updated?" No other crap popping up and making noise or distracting you. And phone number plus code had fewer problems than meeting invites for all the hip services. Maybe not having VR will end up being one of those things that signals either low or high status. I can't imagine C-suite types fucking around with VR except for big all-hands announcements or whatever.

Isn’t that just the definition of network effect? Meta is clearly betting that at a certain critical mass not owning a VR headset in a professional environment will be like not owning a webcam.

jonny_eh 4y ago

How do I bet that they're wrong?

weeblewobble 4y ago
short $META?

spywaregorilla 4y ago

I think it will come across as unprofessional to join a meeting in vr personally. And triply so if not everyone, or everyone of a certain class is doing it. VR is goofy, and it'll continue to be goofy. Like... ok so you have an avatar. Are a cartoon? That's a bad start. Are they maybe an unreal meta human that looks like you? Different than you? Like you, but poorly done? Ok whatever let's assume the rendering is fine. What are you doing in this virtual meeting? Are you standing? Because that would be very weird for a business meeting. Presumably you're sitting irl because this is work, so maybe your avatar is sitting... Do they have a table in the virtual room? Because a meeting with no table is a bit odd for a business setting. But if you're in VR, you probably don't have a table in front of you irl. Or at least not the same table that's virtually in front of you. What does your body language track? What if Carol starts lagging and her avatar starts jerking around? What if your facial tracking gets something wrong and you just have a weird look on your face? Or more realistically your facial tracking is just a pretty simplistic thing that vacillates between neutral and smiling and you need to convey negative emotions? In snow crash, the thing that made the metaverse work was very strong facial expression mimicry. It's not a terrible argument, but we don't have that. We have fake expressive facial mimicry that looks emotive but isn't actually that nuanced to your own face. VR Chat for business just seems like a preposterous idea. Especially for older folks.

cwalv 4y ago
Remote work in general seems like a preposterous idea many folks .. even after being forced to do it, they can't really wrap their head around how it works, or why some people like it
onion2k 4y ago
VR Chat for business just seems like a preposterous idea. Especially for older folks. What this usually means is that startups and 'cool' companies adopt it, and then companies run by older people adopt it because they cargo cult anything successful. That could be enough to drive it to the mainstream. It's worked for lots of other tech and ideas (websites, mobile apps, nosql, agile, etc).

kortilla 4y ago

That’s a pretty weak bet given that owning a webcam isn’t even expected for meetings between businesses.

yamtaddle 4y ago

A few years ago when video chat was, if you asked tech workers, already the norm for remote meetings, I know for a fact that at least one of the big three management consulting firms still strongly preferred call-an-actual-phone-number voice conferencing. It struck me as goofy at first but I think they had it right, actually. You can join a call like that from almost anywhere. Don't need to dig out a laptop, let alone VR garbage. Airport, walking down the street on the way to another meeting, in the car on speakerphone (like, probably don't do this, but of course tons of people do), whatever, it all works. No "do I have the service they want installed? Is it updated?" No other crap popping up and making noise or distracting you. And phone number plus code had fewer problems than meeting invites for all the hip services. Maybe not having VR will end up being one of those things that signals either low or high status. I can't imagine C-suite types fucking around with VR except for big all-hands announcements or whatever.