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When most people think "ad", they think that third parties are collecting data about the computer or user attached to it, and then those third parties respond w

When most people think "ad", they think that third parties are collecting data about the computer or user attached to it, and then those third parties respond with a bid and an ad. (Maybe this is done real-time like on the web these days, maybe in advance based on demographics and surveys like on TV.) But this is just self-promotion (the second-party is showing this), and not targeted (the second party didn't collect any signal to decide what ad to show). So yes, possibly annoying that a commercial Linux distro is trying to advertise their commercial products, but hardly nefarious.

benj111 4y ago
No, but the thing is about the shell is you can automate it, so random stuff could break shell scripts. Plus if I wanted random companies marketing things to me I'd use Windows.
- Denvercoder9 4y ago
  > No, but the thing is about the shell is you can automate it, so random stuff could break shell scripts. In this particular case, the user used the "apt" command, which is meant to be used by humans and not by scripts. It's explicitly documented that its output is unstable, and prints out a warning when stdout is not an interactive tty. For scripting, use of the apt-get/apt-cache/etc tools is recommended.
  - nirimda 4y ago
    Fwiw, it's included in the output of `apt-get dist-upgrade`, so using `apt-get` is not going to immunise you from unnecessarily patching scripts that break.
kstenerud 4y ago
When most people think "ad", they think of injecting an attempt to sell you something into an environment where it would not naturally occur, pulling your attention away from what you were doing (commercials, billboards, web pages, magazines, command line tools, MOTDs, books - oh wait they don't do it there yet).
- teawrecks 4y ago
  This is a very old interpretation of the word. Today, "ad" almost always implies "targeted". I guess "what most people think" is a different question...a loaded one imo.
  - denton-scratch 4y ago
    Come on, an ad is an ad. A targeted ad is an ad that's targeted.
  - ThunderSizzle 4y ago
    The old interpretation hasn't changed and is still correct. However, traditional ads aren't nearly as violating as targeted ads, even if they are still annoying, unwanted, etc.
  - nirimda 4y ago
    If you're watching TV and they interrupt the show to say "Consider subscribing to this streaming service, buying that brand of instant noodles, booking a flight to some holiday destination with a certain travel agent", surely that's still an ad break? and if you walk past a bus stop and you notice something inviting you to buy deodorant or vote for a certain candidate, it's still an ad? I've never seriously heard it claimed that "ads" are targeted or they're now something different: do you want to maintain your argument? What are these other things called nowadays?
- im3w1l 4y ago
  I have read books that after the end of the story had a page or two listing similar books. I would classify that as an ad, but I also consider it the kind of respectful and tasteful advertisement that benefits both the publisher and reader. Here's what I like about it: * it doesn't interrupt me when I'm in the middle of something, rather it comes at just the moment when I'm the most interested in purchasing a new book * it's just black normal font-size on white background, nothing screaming or annoying. * it's curated and decent quality recommendations rather than whoever-pays-the-most.
- pxc 4y ago
alpaca128 4y ago
> When most people think "ad", they think that third parties are collecting data about the computer or user attached to it, and then those third parties respond with a bid and an ad No, that's called "targeted ad". Or spyware which happens to also deliver ads, depending on your tolerance for privacy violations. > but hardly nefarious Harmless ads are annoying and distracting too.

benj111 4y ago

No, but the thing is about the shell is you can automate it, so random stuff could break shell scripts. Plus if I wanted random companies marketing things to me I'd use Windows.

Denvercoder9 4y ago
> No, but the thing is about the shell is you can automate it, so random stuff could break shell scripts. In this particular case, the user used the "apt" command, which is meant to be used by humans and not by scripts. It's explicitly documented that its output is unstable, and prints out a warning when stdout is not an interactive tty. For scripting, use of the apt-get/apt-cache/etc tools is recommended.
- nirimda 4y ago
  Fwiw, it's included in the output of `apt-get dist-upgrade`, so using `apt-get` is not going to immunise you from unnecessarily patching scripts that break.

kstenerud 4y ago

When most people think "ad", they think of injecting an attempt to sell you something into an environment where it would not naturally occur, pulling your attention away from what you were doing (commercials, billboards, web pages, magazines, command line tools, MOTDs, books - oh wait they don't do it there yet).

teawrecks 4y ago
This is a very old interpretation of the word. Today, "ad" almost always implies "targeted". I guess "what most people think" is a different question...a loaded one imo.
- denton-scratch 4y ago
  Come on, an ad is an ad. A targeted ad is an ad that's targeted.
- ThunderSizzle 4y ago
  The old interpretation hasn't changed and is still correct. However, traditional ads aren't nearly as violating as targeted ads, even if they are still annoying, unwanted, etc.
- nirimda 4y ago
  If you're watching TV and they interrupt the show to say "Consider subscribing to this streaming service, buying that brand of instant noodles, booking a flight to some holiday destination with a certain travel agent", surely that's still an ad break? and if you walk past a bus stop and you notice something inviting you to buy deodorant or vote for a certain candidate, it's still an ad? I've never seriously heard it claimed that "ads" are targeted or they're now something different: do you want to maintain your argument? What are these other things called nowadays?
im3w1l 4y ago
I have read books that after the end of the story had a page or two listing similar books. I would classify that as an ad, but I also consider it the kind of respectful and tasteful advertisement that benefits both the publisher and reader. Here's what I like about it: * it doesn't interrupt me when I'm in the middle of something, rather it comes at just the moment when I'm the most interested in purchasing a new book * it's just black normal font-size on white background, nothing screaming or annoying. * it's curated and decent quality recommendations rather than whoever-pays-the-most.
pxc 4y ago

alpaca128 4y ago

> When most people think "ad", they think that third parties are collecting data about the computer or user attached to it, and then those third parties respond with a bid and an ad No, that's called "targeted ad". Or spyware which happens to also deliver ads, depending on your tolerance for privacy violations. > but hardly nefarious Harmless ads are annoying and distracting too.