4 ms·

Nursing is not relatively high paying. The opposite. When you look at the training required and the hours you have to put in, it's underpaid compared to male do

Nursing is not relatively high paying. The opposite. When you look at the training required and the hours you have to put in, it's underpaid compared to male dominated professions that require similar training and hours. Researchers analyzed 50 years of U.S. Census data and found that pay drops when professions move from predominantly male to female – in short, if women do a job, it’s likely to be low-paid, for no other reason than that women’s work is undervalued. https://www.payscale.com/career-advice/when-an-occupation-becomes-female-dominated-pay-declines/ https://www.payscale.com/career-advice/when-an-occupation-be... https://academic.oup.com/sf/article-abstract/88/2/865/2235342 https://academic.oup.com/sf/article-abstract/88/2/865/223534...

xwolfi 4y ago
It is relatively high paying where I live (Hong Kong) and just like where I was born (France) or where you stand (US I guess), the 10 to 1 ratio stays. Men of similar social upbringing to these women are stuck to being dockers, fishermen, movers or otherwise. Not that I have any conclusion lol I have a 4 yo daughter I try to raise like a boy and her fav color is still pink, to my utter rage lol
- tchaffee 4y ago
  > Men of similar social upbringing to these women are stuck to being dockers, fishermen, movers or otherwise. What docker or fishermen are required to have a minimum of a 2 year degree and a difficult licensing test? A test that some states require you to re-take at regular intervals? A better comparison would be programmers. Although there is no minimum degree, no licensing test, and the pay is quite a bit higher than nursing. Significantly the pay was much lower when it was a female dominated profession.
jcoq 4y ago
Nursing only requires a 2 year degree in the US and hardly any ongoing training apart from paid training provided by the hospital. There might be some additional certifications for certain fields, but that's it. Most nurses are paid hourly, so the "long hours" is a moot point. My nurse friends all make around 100,000 per year after overtime, which they're eager to get. The average full time salary without overtime is ~80,000. For a 2 year degree, this is very decent money in most states and I think we'd struggle to name a career with such low education requirements and high salary. I really appreciate the work of medical professionals and don't want to belittle their work. But I think nursing does standout as a counterexample to the point you're making. Neither of your links mention nursing.
- linuxftw 4y ago
  Nurses I know with 4 year degrees are making less than $30/hr.
  - tchaffee 4y ago
    Considering the median hourly pay in 2021 was $37.31, this is easily believable and probably quite common. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab-1 https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab...
- tchaffee 4y ago
  > Nursing only requires a 2 year degree It also requires passing a licensing test. Passing the licensing test requires self-study. You need to include this time in the training requirements for the profession. Most jobs do not require a licensing test. So when comparing you need to find similar jobs with 2 year degree + licensing requirements. > The average full time salary without overtime is ~80,000. That's exaggerated. The median pay is $77,600. Or a better measure is the $37.31 per hour. That is not a high hourly rate by any measure. [1] > I think we'd struggle to name a career with such low education requirements and high salary. No we wouldn't. Large numbers of programmers don't even have a degree - it's not required for sure - and earn way more than nurses. Licensing is not required. Mandatory overtime is not rampant. Programming being a male dominated field. > Most nurses are paid hourly, so the "long hours" is a moot point. It's not moot at all. In many cases it is a job requirement, not optional. NY for example only passed a law in 2009 making mandatory overtime illegal for nurses. It was so rampant that states have passed laws about it. That makes the career far harder than most jobs where overtime is often optional. And to date, only 18 states have laws against mandatory overtime for nurses. > Neither of your links mention nursing. That's wrong. The 1st link shows a chart with a comparison of careers with similar training and the chart shows nursing in that comparison. [1] https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab-1 https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab...
  - rendang 4y ago
    The cognitive ability required to be an RN is nowhere near that required for programming, degree or no.
0x445442 4y ago
PAs and NPs are the highest on this list... You and I reckon relatively different. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/fastest-growing.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/fastest-growing.htm
- tchaffee 4y ago
  Fastest growing says nothing about pay relative to training.
  - 0x445442 4y ago
    Fastest growing has nothing to do with the link I posted. What is relevant is they were the highest paying jobs on that list. Compared to all wage jobs, nursing pays relatively high. Just take the L and move on.
    - tchaffee 4y ago
      > Fastest growing has nothing to do with the link I posted. Let me highlight the relevant part of the link you posted: https://www.bls.gov/ooh/**FASTEST-GROWING**.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/**FASTEST-GROWING**.htm > What is relevant is they were the highest paying jobs on that list. It's not relevant. We aren't talking about comparing salaries of the fastest growing jobs. We are comparing jobs that require similar training. > Compared to all wage jobs, No. Compared to other fastest growing jobs. Your list is fastest growing jobs. Not all wage jobs. > they were the highest paying jobs on that list Even that's wrong. If you click the buttons on the salary column to sort by salary, you'll see that "Physician assistants" get paid more. And you got even more wrong... Nurse PRACTITIONERS were on the top of your list. That requires a Master's degree. That's a much higher paying job than registered nurses. Registered nurses being the vast majority of jobs with the title of nurse. From your own source, the pay for licensed nurses is $48,070 per year or $23.11 per hour. You must complete a state-approved educational program, which typically takes about 1 year to complete. For comparison, you can get paid $24.87 per hour delivering mail for the US post office. Only a high school diploma is required. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/licensed-practical-and-licensed-vocational-nurses.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/licensed-practical-and-li... Registered nurses, which require a 2 year degree, and licensing, do make more ($77,600 per year or $37.31 per hour) than vocational nurses, but nowhere near what nurse practitioners make. And many registered nurses have a four year degree. That's a pretty low hourly wage for a four year degree in a science-based profession. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm

xwolfi 4y ago

It is relatively high paying where I live (Hong Kong) and just like where I was born (France) or where you stand (US I guess), the 10 to 1 ratio stays. Men of similar social upbringing to these women are stuck to being dockers, fishermen, movers or otherwise. Not that I have any conclusion lol I have a 4 yo daughter I try to raise like a boy and her fav color is still pink, to my utter rage lol

tchaffee 4y ago
> Men of similar social upbringing to these women are stuck to being dockers, fishermen, movers or otherwise. What docker or fishermen are required to have a minimum of a 2 year degree and a difficult licensing test? A test that some states require you to re-take at regular intervals? A better comparison would be programmers. Although there is no minimum degree, no licensing test, and the pay is quite a bit higher than nursing. Significantly the pay was much lower when it was a female dominated profession.

jcoq 4y ago

Nursing only requires a 2 year degree in the US and hardly any ongoing training apart from paid training provided by the hospital. There might be some additional certifications for certain fields, but that's it. Most nurses are paid hourly, so the "long hours" is a moot point. My nurse friends all make around 100,000 per year after overtime, which they're eager to get. The average full time salary without overtime is ~80,000. For a 2 year degree, this is very decent money in most states and I think we'd struggle to name a career with such low education requirements and high salary. I really appreciate the work of medical professionals and don't want to belittle their work. But I think nursing does standout as a counterexample to the point you're making. Neither of your links mention nursing.

linuxftw 4y ago
Nurses I know with 4 year degrees are making less than $30/hr.
- tchaffee 4y ago
  Considering the median hourly pay in 2021 was $37.31, this is easily believable and probably quite common. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab-1 https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab...
tchaffee 4y ago
> Nursing only requires a 2 year degree It also requires passing a licensing test. Passing the licensing test requires self-study. You need to include this time in the training requirements for the profession. Most jobs do not require a licensing test. So when comparing you need to find similar jobs with 2 year degree + licensing requirements. > The average full time salary without overtime is ~80,000. That's exaggerated. The median pay is $77,600. Or a better measure is the $37.31 per hour. That is not a high hourly rate by any measure. [1] > I think we'd struggle to name a career with such low education requirements and high salary. No we wouldn't. Large numbers of programmers don't even have a degree - it's not required for sure - and earn way more than nurses. Licensing is not required. Mandatory overtime is not rampant. Programming being a male dominated field. > Most nurses are paid hourly, so the "long hours" is a moot point. It's not moot at all. In many cases it is a job requirement, not optional. NY for example only passed a law in 2009 making mandatory overtime illegal for nurses. It was so rampant that states have passed laws about it. That makes the career far harder than most jobs where overtime is often optional. And to date, only 18 states have laws against mandatory overtime for nurses. > Neither of your links mention nursing. That's wrong. The 1st link shows a chart with a comparison of careers with similar training and the chart shows nursing in that comparison. [1] https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab-1 https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm#tab...
- rendang 4y ago
  The cognitive ability required to be an RN is nowhere near that required for programming, degree or no.

0x445442 4y ago

PAs and NPs are the highest on this list... You and I reckon relatively different. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/fastest-growing.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/fastest-growing.htm

tchaffee 4y ago
Fastest growing says nothing about pay relative to training.
- 0x445442 4y ago
  Fastest growing has nothing to do with the link I posted. What is relevant is they were the highest paying jobs on that list. Compared to all wage jobs, nursing pays relatively high. Just take the L and move on.
  - tchaffee 4y ago
    > Fastest growing has nothing to do with the link I posted. Let me highlight the relevant part of the link you posted: https://www.bls.gov/ooh/**FASTEST-GROWING**.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/**FASTEST-GROWING**.htm > What is relevant is they were the highest paying jobs on that list. It's not relevant. We aren't talking about comparing salaries of the fastest growing jobs. We are comparing jobs that require similar training. > Compared to all wage jobs, No. Compared to other fastest growing jobs. Your list is fastest growing jobs. Not all wage jobs. > they were the highest paying jobs on that list Even that's wrong. If you click the buttons on the salary column to sort by salary, you'll see that "Physician assistants" get paid more. And you got even more wrong... Nurse PRACTITIONERS were on the top of your list. That requires a Master's degree. That's a much higher paying job than registered nurses. Registered nurses being the vast majority of jobs with the title of nurse. From your own source, the pay for licensed nurses is $48,070 per year or $23.11 per hour. You must complete a state-approved educational program, which typically takes about 1 year to complete. For comparison, you can get paid $24.87 per hour delivering mail for the US post office. Only a high school diploma is required. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/licensed-practical-and-licensed-vocational-nurses.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/licensed-practical-and-li... Registered nurses, which require a 2 year degree, and licensing, do make more ($77,600 per year or $37.31 per hour) than vocational nurses, but nowhere near what nurse practitioners make. And many registered nurses have a four year degree. That's a pretty low hourly wage for a four year degree in a science-based profession. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/healthcare/registered-nurses.htm