7 ms·

Agree, I honestly don't understand the level of optimism shown here. To me this sounds like exactly the opposite of how I would like to work in the future. The

Agree, I honestly don't understand the level of optimism shown here. To me this sounds like exactly the opposite of how I would like to work in the future. The fact that Facebook fully controls the software and hardware platform is just a huge additional turnoff.

mensetmanusman 4y ago
I wouldn’t be surprised if open hardware is gone for good. There is too much money to be made with SAAS.
Youden 4y ago
I don't like Facebook any more than you but to be fair, they're not as bad as they could be. For on-device software sideloading is available and SideQuest makes it pretty functional. Additionally, the device supports OpenVR and can be used with any software you'd like to run on your desktop PC. It's more the Google approach to the ecosystem than it is the Apple approach, though I don't believe the OS is open-source.
- harph 4y ago
  Does that mean I don't need to create an account if I want to use the headset only with OpenVR stuff?
  - wolrah 4y ago
    No, unfortunately to use it with a PC you need to have their app installed on the PC as well and be signed in on both.
    - vachina 4y ago
      Imagine buying a monitor and being forced to install the manufacturer’s app just to display stuff on it. Eh. No.
      - saiya-jin 4y ago
        You must be young, that was exactly how things were for decades. Its just that it was called a driver, not an app but in effect it was same piece of software that unlocked the device for use. For monitors, often without proprietary driver, it would work only on some default vesa resolutions, not support all available refresh rates etc.
        wolrah 4y ago
        A monitor driver, at least in the form most people remember dealing with on Win32 systems, wasn't even a piece of software. It was just a .INF file containing the Windows equivalent to X modelines describing what modes and was only necessary if you either didn't have working EDID for whatever reason or wanted to go outside the range the monitor advertised working at. Before these "drivers" had to be signed it was common for various graphics tweak tools to provide a method for building your own custom INF to "overclock" a monitor that only officially supported 60 Hz or whatever.
      - wolrah 4y ago
        This isn't a monitor though, it's another standalone computer that you're streaming an image to. The wired connection option isn't using DisplayPort or HDMI signaling over USB-C, it's establishing a network connection over the USB link and then streaming video over that in the same way as it would over WiFi. VR headsets that don't contain their own processing on the other hand do in fact work like a normal monitor. Usually they'll go in to a "direct mode" that does not appear as a monitor when their drivers are installed for both performance and convenience reasons, but they can be configured to just appear as yet another monitor.
  - agar 4y ago
    You need a Meta account. Not a Facebook (social network) account. Meta accounts only require an email address. There is no real name requirement, which they explicitly state in their help page[1] so this isn't a violation of the TOS. [1] https://www.meta.com/help/accounts/set-up-meta-account/ https://www.meta.com/help/accounts/set-up-meta-account/, see "Setting up your Meta account with email" section.
- moolcool 4y ago
  Embrace, extend, extinguish
maest 4y ago
> The fact that Facebook fully controls the software and hardware platform is just a huge additional turnoff. I'm actually quite optimistic: I don't see a reason why Meta will be the only player in VR. I don't think long term they can maintain a moat on a hardware level - other headset producers will pop up once the tech is better understood and we may end up with a situation similar to what we currently have in the console world (2-3 big players and a few niche ones). I think Meta sees that and are trying to build a moat on a social-networking level and, honestly, I don't know how well that will work.
fullshark 4y ago
Because we desperately need something to keep the party going, computers/internet tech can't have fully matured, that means the war for market share and labor will have finished and we'll all be where mechanical engineers are today in terms of compensation.
deleted 4y ago
[deleted]
zmmmmm 4y ago
Curious what you don't like about it. So many of the people who say this are basing on assumptions that are either solved or on a clear path to being solved. For example people say it's uncomfortable : solved now by Quest Pro. People say resolution isn't high enough. Clear path to being solved as display tech and foveated rendering takes over. Don't like being isolated? Solved by Quest Pro with high quality pass through and open side profile. Can't type without seeing your hands? Solved by Quest Pro. Experienced nausea once upon a time using VR? I will bet 80% chance its solved because the tech has gotten vastly better.
- colonwqbang 4y ago
  I guess I just don't see what the benefit would be in the first place. I can see the benefit fine for video games and similar, but not really for using microsoft word or coding. But then again I haven't tried it
- exodust 4y ago
  > uncomfortable : solved now by Quest Pro. For a lot of people the very fact you have a device on your head is what's uncomfortable. Screens in front of your eyes, your senses boxed in. That's the point of VR, which is why it won't be adopted as widely as some are hoping.
- tirpen 4y ago
  Is the "owned by an ridiculously evil corporation that makes it's money by creating social strife, ruining society, destroying lives and brainwashing people"-problem on the path to being solved?
- fullshark 4y ago
  They probably disagree that it's solved. I"ve used Quest 2 and the idea of having to do my job with it is excruciating.
  - zmmmmm 4y ago
    I would say you kind of exemplify the problem then. The Quest Pro is aimed like a laser at fixing all of these issues (with the exception of resolution, my main gripe). But your willingness to extrapolate your experience on a $300 headset to infer the limit of everything that will ever be possible is way over-reaching. Of course, I am over-reaching in the sense that I haven't tried the Quest Pro yet so who knows how real any of the improvements are. But I don't have any trouble believing the tech will get there whether it's this product or future ones.

mensetmanusman 4y ago

I wouldn’t be surprised if open hardware is gone for good. There is too much money to be made with SAAS.

Youden 4y ago

I don't like Facebook any more than you but to be fair, they're not as bad as they could be. For on-device software sideloading is available and SideQuest makes it pretty functional. Additionally, the device supports OpenVR and can be used with any software you'd like to run on your desktop PC. It's more the Google approach to the ecosystem than it is the Apple approach, though I don't believe the OS is open-source.

harph 4y ago
Does that mean I don't need to create an account if I want to use the headset only with OpenVR stuff?
- wolrah 4y ago
  No, unfortunately to use it with a PC you need to have their app installed on the PC as well and be signed in on both.
  - vachina 4y ago
    Imagine buying a monitor and being forced to install the manufacturer’s app just to display stuff on it. Eh. No.
    - saiya-jin 4y ago
      You must be young, that was exactly how things were for decades. Its just that it was called a driver, not an app but in effect it was same piece of software that unlocked the device for use. For monitors, often without proprietary driver, it would work only on some default vesa resolutions, not support all available refresh rates etc.
      - wolrah 4y ago
        A monitor driver, at least in the form most people remember dealing with on Win32 systems, wasn't even a piece of software. It was just a .INF file containing the Windows equivalent to X modelines describing what modes and was only necessary if you either didn't have working EDID for whatever reason or wanted to go outside the range the monitor advertised working at. Before these "drivers" had to be signed it was common for various graphics tweak tools to provide a method for building your own custom INF to "overclock" a monitor that only officially supported 60 Hz or whatever.
    - wolrah 4y ago
      This isn't a monitor though, it's another standalone computer that you're streaming an image to. The wired connection option isn't using DisplayPort or HDMI signaling over USB-C, it's establishing a network connection over the USB link and then streaming video over that in the same way as it would over WiFi. VR headsets that don't contain their own processing on the other hand do in fact work like a normal monitor. Usually they'll go in to a "direct mode" that does not appear as a monitor when their drivers are installed for both performance and convenience reasons, but they can be configured to just appear as yet another monitor.
- agar 4y ago
  You need a Meta account. Not a Facebook (social network) account. Meta accounts only require an email address. There is no real name requirement, which they explicitly state in their help page[1] so this isn't a violation of the TOS. [1] https://www.meta.com/help/accounts/set-up-meta-account/ https://www.meta.com/help/accounts/set-up-meta-account/, see "Setting up your Meta account with email" section.
moolcool 4y ago
Embrace, extend, extinguish

maest 4y ago

> The fact that Facebook fully controls the software and hardware platform is just a huge additional turnoff. I'm actually quite optimistic: I don't see a reason why Meta will be the only player in VR. I don't think long term they can maintain a moat on a hardware level - other headset producers will pop up once the tech is better understood and we may end up with a situation similar to what we currently have in the console world (2-3 big players and a few niche ones). I think Meta sees that and are trying to build a moat on a social-networking level and, honestly, I don't know how well that will work.

fullshark 4y ago

Because we desperately need something to keep the party going, computers/internet tech can't have fully matured, that means the war for market share and labor will have finished and we'll all be where mechanical engineers are today in terms of compensation.

deleted 4y ago

[deleted]

zmmmmm 4y ago

Curious what you don't like about it. So many of the people who say this are basing on assumptions that are either solved or on a clear path to being solved. For example people say it's uncomfortable : solved now by Quest Pro. People say resolution isn't high enough. Clear path to being solved as display tech and foveated rendering takes over. Don't like being isolated? Solved by Quest Pro with high quality pass through and open side profile. Can't type without seeing your hands? Solved by Quest Pro. Experienced nausea once upon a time using VR? I will bet 80% chance its solved because the tech has gotten vastly better.

colonwqbang 4y ago
I guess I just don't see what the benefit would be in the first place. I can see the benefit fine for video games and similar, but not really for using microsoft word or coding. But then again I haven't tried it
exodust 4y ago
> uncomfortable : solved now by Quest Pro. For a lot of people the very fact you have a device on your head is what's uncomfortable. Screens in front of your eyes, your senses boxed in. That's the point of VR, which is why it won't be adopted as widely as some are hoping.
tirpen 4y ago
Is the "owned by an ridiculously evil corporation that makes it's money by creating social strife, ruining society, destroying lives and brainwashing people"-problem on the path to being solved?
fullshark 4y ago
They probably disagree that it's solved. I"ve used Quest 2 and the idea of having to do my job with it is excruciating.
- zmmmmm 4y ago
  I would say you kind of exemplify the problem then. The Quest Pro is aimed like a laser at fixing all of these issues (with the exception of resolution, my main gripe). But your willingness to extrapolate your experience on a $300 headset to infer the limit of everything that will ever be possible is way over-reaching. Of course, I am over-reaching in the sense that I haven't tried the Quest Pro yet so who knows how real any of the improvements are. But I don't have any trouble believing the tech will get there whether it's this product or future ones.