4 ms·

> Get rid of private schools There are good steps that can be taken, but objectively harming some students is not the way forward. Improve public schools and

> Get rid of private schools There are good steps that can be taken, but objectively harming some students is not the way forward. Improve public schools and try to get more money into the poor regions. Do not erase private ones.

kthejoker2 4y ago
Why not the way forward? Depends on the "some" being "harmed." This is a systemic problem, systemic measures will be taken, there will be winners and losers.
- bioemerl 4y ago
  > Depends on the "some" being "harmed." How does harming anyone help? No it does not depend on the some. Life isn't a zero sum game. Pull people down and you don't distribute their value to others, you only destroy it.
  - kthejoker2 4y ago
    You are begging the question, I don't believe eliminating private schooling harms anyone, nor will it "pull people down." Inequity in schooling is already harming others.
    - bioemerl 4y ago
      But in the comment I'll responded to you said and I quote " It depends on the some who are being harmed" "There will be winners and losers" That doesn't sound to me like someone who believes eliminating private schools harms nobody, That sounds to me like someone who is being a little bit reactionary and doesn't care. You aren't harming anyone, but there will be losers?
MisterBastahrd 4y ago
Nope. Get rid of all of them. Private schools are just legal segregation. Forcing rich people's kids to go to school with poor and average kids will give their parents a huge incentive to lobby for the increased quality of public schools. Lottery systems would make it even better. Education and healthcare being made available to everybody at the exact same availability and quality level would majorly improve both systems.
- bioemerl 4y ago
  > Forcing rich people's kids to go to school with poor and average kids will ... Cause rich families to blanket refuse to live anywhere near neighborhoods with poor kids and contribute massively to the segregation between well off and impoverished neighborhoods. Just live in a place where every home in a 45 minute radius is over a million dollars to purchase.
  - yamtaddle 4y ago
    Right—in my city all the rich people neighborhoods in the city proper only exist because of private schools. If you have some money, but not enough for an expensive in-the-city house in a non-terrible neighborhood plus private school, you do not live there—you live in the 'burbs. All the urban- and close-old-suburb dwelling rich people would pack up and leave within a year if they were forced to send their kids to public school. Or find some way to get themselves a weird-bordered carved-out new district all to themselves. That's the only possible way they'd stay.
  - MisterBastahrd 4y ago
    That's why I said lottery systems. If they want to bus their kids 45 minutes to be stuck in the same school system, that's on them. I don't care.
- yamtaddle 4y ago
  This will only work if you also forbid rich people from homeschooling (= private tutors supplemented with sports & social clubs full of other rich kids—and very-well-funded rich-parent homeschooling support groups would probably start to look an awful lot like private schools themselves) and from sending their kids out of the country for school. Day school rates for good private schools (there are way, way more bad private schools than good ones) are in like the $20k-$60k/yr range. That's a lot of money to put toward avoiding public school, even if US private schools themselves are outlawed. You'd have to also mandate public school attendance, no alternatives whatsoever. You'd also have to do something to prevent rich people from effectively buying whole school districts and turning them into private schools. There are already districts kinda like this—unleash the entire upper-middle and upper class on the current public school system, and pretty soon there will be a few dozen districts nationwide where it's impossible to buy a house for under a million dollars and the schools may as well be private schools.

kthejoker2 4y ago

Why not the way forward? Depends on the "some" being "harmed." This is a systemic problem, systemic measures will be taken, there will be winners and losers.

bioemerl 4y ago
> Depends on the "some" being "harmed." How does harming anyone help? No it does not depend on the some. Life isn't a zero sum game. Pull people down and you don't distribute their value to others, you only destroy it.
- kthejoker2 4y ago
  You are begging the question, I don't believe eliminating private schooling harms anyone, nor will it "pull people down." Inequity in schooling is already harming others.
  - bioemerl 4y ago
    But in the comment I'll responded to you said and I quote " It depends on the some who are being harmed" "There will be winners and losers" That doesn't sound to me like someone who believes eliminating private schools harms nobody, That sounds to me like someone who is being a little bit reactionary and doesn't care. You aren't harming anyone, but there will be losers?

MisterBastahrd 4y ago

Nope. Get rid of all of them. Private schools are just legal segregation. Forcing rich people's kids to go to school with poor and average kids will give their parents a huge incentive to lobby for the increased quality of public schools. Lottery systems would make it even better. Education and healthcare being made available to everybody at the exact same availability and quality level would majorly improve both systems.

bioemerl 4y ago
> Forcing rich people's kids to go to school with poor and average kids will ... Cause rich families to blanket refuse to live anywhere near neighborhoods with poor kids and contribute massively to the segregation between well off and impoverished neighborhoods. Just live in a place where every home in a 45 minute radius is over a million dollars to purchase.
- yamtaddle 4y ago
  Right—in my city all the rich people neighborhoods in the city proper only exist because of private schools. If you have some money, but not enough for an expensive in-the-city house in a non-terrible neighborhood plus private school, you do not live there—you live in the 'burbs. All the urban- and close-old-suburb dwelling rich people would pack up and leave within a year if they were forced to send their kids to public school. Or find some way to get themselves a weird-bordered carved-out new district all to themselves. That's the only possible way they'd stay.
- MisterBastahrd 4y ago
  That's why I said lottery systems. If they want to bus their kids 45 minutes to be stuck in the same school system, that's on them. I don't care.
yamtaddle 4y ago
This will only work if you also forbid rich people from homeschooling (= private tutors supplemented with sports & social clubs full of other rich kids—and very-well-funded rich-parent homeschooling support groups would probably start to look an awful lot like private schools themselves) and from sending their kids out of the country for school. Day school rates for good private schools (there are way, way more bad private schools than good ones) are in like the $20k-$60k/yr range. That's a lot of money to put toward avoiding public school, even if US private schools themselves are outlawed. You'd have to also mandate public school attendance, no alternatives whatsoever. You'd also have to do something to prevent rich people from effectively buying whole school districts and turning them into private schools. There are already districts kinda like this—unleash the entire upper-middle and upper class on the current public school system, and pretty soon there will be a few dozen districts nationwide where it's impossible to buy a house for under a million dollars and the schools may as well be private schools.