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Not having a SO profile is a non issue, for most of my career I didn’t have one. I still boycott LinkedIn as well out of principle. Neither of this has prevente

Not having a SO profile is a non issue, for most of my career I didn’t have one. I still boycott LinkedIn as well out of principle. Neither of this has prevented me from getting clients and jobs. I’m sure some wacko hiring departments demand a super active SO profile. They’re irrelevant to the larger discussion tbh.

paulryanrogers 4y ago
If you believe hiring departments shouldn't use such signals then how can they be a "fantastic resource to put on a CV" and "skill amplifier"?
- scrollaway 4y ago
  Demanding as a requirement is not the same thing as using as a signal.
  - paulryanrogers 4y ago
    So it's OK to use signals that push already disadvantaged groups further down the list of candidates?
    - scrollaway 4y ago
      This is a complex question that doesn't have a yes/no answer, and you're wording it as if you're allergic to nuance and want to bait me into a flamewar. That is the literal definition of "flamebait". Having a particular skill, such as "knowing javascript", is also a signal that "pushes already disadvantaged groups further down the list of candidates". So, you tell me. You're not the first person to think about these issues. This stuff is no different than people publishing their portfolio on artstation, or even on their personal website. And on SO specifically, it's also very similar to having on your CV a list of places you volunteered at: Unpaid jobs to show off your skills.
      - paulryanrogers 4y ago
        Sorry if I've come across as hostile. Just trying to understand how you reconsile what looks like a discrepancy to me. As an individual I can see listing anything that gives me an edge. As a hiring manager I have to be careful to be fair and feel an obligation to avoid signals likely to filter already disadvantaged groups. So for a manager these considerations do come down to a binary: will this signal be used? > Having a particular skill, such as "knowing javascript", is also a signal I'm not advocating removing requirements undeniably needed for a role. SO, volunteering, and unpaid work aren't generally needed for roles I hire for. Therefore as signals they're less useful, and may tend to bias in favor of those who already have other advantages in life. > You're not the first person to think about these issues. Did I suggest I thought I was? And what does it matter if others have considered these things? All of us with hiring power each need to learn what is appropriate, or not, in order to make the best decisions.

paulryanrogers 4y ago

If you believe hiring departments shouldn't use such signals then how can they be a "fantastic resource to put on a CV" and "skill amplifier"?

scrollaway 4y ago
Demanding as a requirement is not the same thing as using as a signal.
- paulryanrogers 4y ago
  So it's OK to use signals that push already disadvantaged groups further down the list of candidates?
  - scrollaway 4y ago
    This is a complex question that doesn't have a yes/no answer, and you're wording it as if you're allergic to nuance and want to bait me into a flamewar. That is the literal definition of "flamebait". Having a particular skill, such as "knowing javascript", is also a signal that "pushes already disadvantaged groups further down the list of candidates". So, you tell me. You're not the first person to think about these issues. This stuff is no different than people publishing their portfolio on artstation, or even on their personal website. And on SO specifically, it's also very similar to having on your CV a list of places you volunteered at: Unpaid jobs to show off your skills.
    - paulryanrogers 4y ago
      Sorry if I've come across as hostile. Just trying to understand how you reconsile what looks like a discrepancy to me. As an individual I can see listing anything that gives me an edge. As a hiring manager I have to be careful to be fair and feel an obligation to avoid signals likely to filter already disadvantaged groups. So for a manager these considerations do come down to a binary: will this signal be used? > Having a particular skill, such as "knowing javascript", is also a signal I'm not advocating removing requirements undeniably needed for a role. SO, volunteering, and unpaid work aren't generally needed for roles I hire for. Therefore as signals they're less useful, and may tend to bias in favor of those who already have other advantages in life. > You're not the first person to think about these issues. Did I suggest I thought I was? And what does it matter if others have considered these things? All of us with hiring power each need to learn what is appropriate, or not, in order to make the best decisions.