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And no military target was hit. Why did they target cities and not military targets on the front lines? If you want to directly donate to UA army you can donat

And no military target was hit. Why did they target cities and not military targets on the front lines? If you want to directly donate to UA army you can donate here https://www.supportukraine.cz/en.html https://www.supportukraine.cz/en.html via bank transfer and here https://www.weaponstoukraine.com/ https://www.weaponstoukraine.com/ by credit card.

hnbad 4y ago
Because they didn't learn their lesson from the 20th century that targeting civilians doesn't break resolve but reinvigorates it by making them hate you more. Civilian targets are easier to hit because it doesn't matter what you're firing at specifically as the goal isn't destruction of specific targets but spreading terror. Hitting a military outpost needs to be much more precise because hitting an open patch nearby will do nothing but hitting a plaza or park will still inflict terror by maiming nearby civilians.
- nerdponx 4y ago
  I wonder if this was true in Germany or Japan during WW2 when the USA was firebombing cities (later nuking) and thereby mass murdering civilians. Did that strengthen the resolve of the German and Japanese people, or weaken it? I remember reading something about how it didn't weaken resolve in Japan specifically because people were already prepared to fight until the last man. Presumably Ukranians are also prepared to do the same. As for this specific attack, I wonder if the goal is to get global companies to fear operating in Ukraine, resulting in the same effects as if they'd been sanctioned.
  - 5560675260 4y ago
    Not sure about Germany or Japan, but I remember reading that bombing campaign didn't manage to hurt morale in Britain. As for Ukraine - can't speak for everyone - but personally I feel that it's preferable to die fighting than to give up my country and then perish in one of the waves of ethnic cleansing.
  - ncmncm 4y ago
    Japan being ruled autocratically, their civilian resolve might not have mattered much. Blockade eliminating fuel imports had them ready to surrender already. The nukes were meant to scare Russia. But Russia already knew all about the nukes. So, in the end the nukes and the other civil firestorms were just war crimes. But the victor is not prosecuted.
    - RestlessMind 4y ago
      > had them ready to surrender already. Any citation? This is the first time I have heard this claim.
      - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
        > This is the first time I have heard this claim. Good, because the claim is false. When the emperor decided to surrender, he faced a coup attempt. This was after two atomic bombs and the Russian invasion of Manchuria ("the twin shocks"). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident
        ncmncm 4y ago
        They were, in fact, out of fuel and unable to operate heavy industry, and faced disaster. That the generals had personal opinions they were empowered to act upon did not change the objective fact that as a nation they could no longer wage war, nukes or no nukes. The emperor wanted to negotiate a surrender. They ended up with an "unconditional" surrender, but with an under the table promise to allow the emperor to keep his title.
- throwaway9870 4y ago
  Not true, Sherman proved it can work to great effect. In some cases like London, it strengthened the will of the civilians, in other wars it did not.
chinathrow 4y ago
War crimes after war crimes, I hope justice day will come.
squidbeak 4y ago
Perhaps because of the vengeful clamour in Russia's media to punish Ukraine with strikes on civilian infrastructure and give Ukrainians a dark freezing winter. Front line strikes have limited value where the line is long and troop concentrations are dispersed.
- dragontamer 4y ago
  > Front line strikes have limited value where the line is long and troop concentrations are dispersed. The Russians failed to strike RADAR, air-defenses, airplanes / fighters, drones, helicopters, or any other powerful (and expensive) targets. They were unable to strike M777 or HIMARS, or ammunition depos. This means that the Russians do not have the intelligence, or capability, to strike at military targets. Or they're too stupid to understand proper SEAD operations or why the ammo-dumps are useful to blow up. ------ Ukraine only has 120-ish M777 guns. Why didn't Russia just blow up all the M777 guns? Its not a big number. Or what about the 12 HIMARS launchers they're using? Its an incredibly small number of HIMARS. Answer: Russia is incapable of doing so. They either don't have the intelligence to find them, or they are too well defended that Russia didn't think such strikes would be successful.
  - stunt 4y ago
    - Russia's intelligence can't compete with all the intelligence and counterintelligence that multiple more capable countries are providing to Ukraine. Not to mention that all those intelligence sources are not target-able by Russia obviously because they don't want to fight NATO directly. So Russia can't even exhaust those intelligence resources. - Ukraine is a huge country and they are doing a good job defending their critical assets and don't forget they have best in class training and intelligence to help them just do that. - Russia has destroyed many military targets during the conflicts. Obviously both sides lie about their casualties. - Ukraine is backed by west and receives new supplies every day. Much more than publicized. The 12 HIMARS is not real. The actual figures are never shared, as it would be too foolish to give such information to the enemy.
deworms 4y ago
- _kbh_ 4y ago
  > It's because Ukraine has no military infrastructure to speak of, anymore. The common tactic thus far was to station military staff and supplies in civilian buildings, move them out before a strike if possible, then release a news report how Russians are targeting civilian installations. There is a reason this keeps happening, no one spends a billion dollars just shooting missiles at random. Russia 100% does, or else, if they where actually hitting military targets with these missiles they would of won the war by now. Russia uses these terror strikes on civilians as a method of waging war, an attempt to get the enemy to surrender. It's an act of terror, and just one of many war crimes Russia commits weekly.
  - deworms 4y ago
    - _kbh_ 4y ago
      Every single city in Ukraine that Russia has occupied and subsequently left, and why not throw in Chechnya for fun as well. Russia is incapable of conducting proper military operations, its why they rely on their 20th century terror tactics. They haven't learnt that these tactics don't work all the time and can at times just embolden the populace against the enemy.
    - krzyk 4y ago
  - eternalban 4y ago
    "The attacks lasted eleven weeks and, according to various estimates, in between 1,200 and 2,500 people were killed. Many buildings, businesses, schools, health centres, media headquarters and cultural monuments were severely damaged or destroyed. A group of economists from the G17 Plus party has estimated the total damages to be about 29.6 billion dollars." Google it. It wasn't the Russians.
foverzar 4y ago
- WesolyKubeczek 4y ago
  So now you have to be an expert to be able to tell whether a playground in a park is a military target or not.
  - spaceheater 4y ago
    https://i.imgur.com/XVEpFHg.jpg https://i.imgur.com/XVEpFHg.jpg
    - _kbh_ 4y ago
      but Kyiv is no where near the front line, having any equipment like artillery deployed there makes no sense.
      - spaceheater 4y ago
        Honestly, I have no idea when and where this picture is from. And for the sake of argument let's say both sides use such tactics. However this does answer the question: "Why playgrounds and parks are targeted"
        justsomehnguy 4y ago
        > idea when No later than February 26, 2022 https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t1sm0n/howitzers_in_densely_populated_area/ https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t1sm0n/howit... > and where Severodonetsk > Honestly, I have no idea when and where this picture is from If only someone made a search engine, which could search by an images...
  - foverzar 4y ago
    One definitely doesn't even have to be an expert in rhetorics to identify your weak manipulations. 2 of like 100 missiles that might have just as well been shot down by the AA system (which, surprise, also shoot missiles, that might hit the target, or...). Yes, it seems to me you need at least some expertise or at least have some understanding of basic logic, or maybe at least a vague familiarity with the matter conservation law to ask yourself: Where do missiles shot down by an AA system go? Where do AA missiles, that didn't hit the target go?
ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
Can you please stop giving out unofficial links? Here are the official ones: https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/support-the-armed-forces https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/support-the-armed-forces https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/humanitarian-aid-to-ukraine https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/humanitarian-aid-to-ukraine
- _visgean 4y ago
  The links that I posted are very much official. They are both projects of ukranian embassy in Prague. All the money will be used for direct weapons purchase. Again this is official project by the ukranian government (https://czechia.mfa.gov.ua/cs/news/sbirka-na-podporu-ukrajinske-armady https://czechia.mfa.gov.ua/cs/news/sbirka-na-podporu-ukrajin..., https://mil.in.ua/en/news/in-the-czech-republic-approximately-40-million-euros-have-been-donated-for-weapons-for-ukraine/ https://mil.in.ua/en/news/in-the-czech-republic-approximatel...). Yes the national bank has now some other options and that is cool but that does not make this project in any way unofficial.
  - ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
    The national bank was the very first and original option and is without doubt the most official and direct way to support Ukraine, be it military or humanitarian.

hnbad 4y ago

Because they didn't learn their lesson from the 20th century that targeting civilians doesn't break resolve but reinvigorates it by making them hate you more. Civilian targets are easier to hit because it doesn't matter what you're firing at specifically as the goal isn't destruction of specific targets but spreading terror. Hitting a military outpost needs to be much more precise because hitting an open patch nearby will do nothing but hitting a plaza or park will still inflict terror by maiming nearby civilians.

nerdponx 4y ago
I wonder if this was true in Germany or Japan during WW2 when the USA was firebombing cities (later nuking) and thereby mass murdering civilians. Did that strengthen the resolve of the German and Japanese people, or weaken it? I remember reading something about how it didn't weaken resolve in Japan specifically because people were already prepared to fight until the last man. Presumably Ukranians are also prepared to do the same. As for this specific attack, I wonder if the goal is to get global companies to fear operating in Ukraine, resulting in the same effects as if they'd been sanctioned.
- 5560675260 4y ago
  Not sure about Germany or Japan, but I remember reading that bombing campaign didn't manage to hurt morale in Britain. As for Ukraine - can't speak for everyone - but personally I feel that it's preferable to die fighting than to give up my country and then perish in one of the waves of ethnic cleansing.
- ncmncm 4y ago
  Japan being ruled autocratically, their civilian resolve might not have mattered much. Blockade eliminating fuel imports had them ready to surrender already. The nukes were meant to scare Russia. But Russia already knew all about the nukes. So, in the end the nukes and the other civil firestorms were just war crimes. But the victor is not prosecuted.
  - RestlessMind 4y ago
    > had them ready to surrender already. Any citation? This is the first time I have heard this claim.
    - AnimalMuppet 4y ago
      > This is the first time I have heard this claim. Good, because the claim is false. When the emperor decided to surrender, he faced a coup attempt. This was after two atomic bombs and the Russian invasion of Manchuria ("the twin shocks"). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ky%C5%ABj%C5%8D_incident
      - ncmncm 4y ago
        They were, in fact, out of fuel and unable to operate heavy industry, and faced disaster. That the generals had personal opinions they were empowered to act upon did not change the objective fact that as a nation they could no longer wage war, nukes or no nukes. The emperor wanted to negotiate a surrender. They ended up with an "unconditional" surrender, but with an under the table promise to allow the emperor to keep his title.
throwaway9870 4y ago
Not true, Sherman proved it can work to great effect. In some cases like London, it strengthened the will of the civilians, in other wars it did not.

chinathrow 4y ago

War crimes after war crimes, I hope justice day will come.

squidbeak 4y ago

Perhaps because of the vengeful clamour in Russia's media to punish Ukraine with strikes on civilian infrastructure and give Ukrainians a dark freezing winter. Front line strikes have limited value where the line is long and troop concentrations are dispersed.

dragontamer 4y ago
> Front line strikes have limited value where the line is long and troop concentrations are dispersed. The Russians failed to strike RADAR, air-defenses, airplanes / fighters, drones, helicopters, or any other powerful (and expensive) targets. They were unable to strike M777 or HIMARS, or ammunition depos. This means that the Russians do not have the intelligence, or capability, to strike at military targets. Or they're too stupid to understand proper SEAD operations or why the ammo-dumps are useful to blow up. ------ Ukraine only has 120-ish M777 guns. Why didn't Russia just blow up all the M777 guns? Its not a big number. Or what about the 12 HIMARS launchers they're using? Its an incredibly small number of HIMARS. Answer: Russia is incapable of doing so. They either don't have the intelligence to find them, or they are too well defended that Russia didn't think such strikes would be successful.
- stunt 4y ago
  - Russia's intelligence can't compete with all the intelligence and counterintelligence that multiple more capable countries are providing to Ukraine. Not to mention that all those intelligence sources are not target-able by Russia obviously because they don't want to fight NATO directly. So Russia can't even exhaust those intelligence resources. - Ukraine is a huge country and they are doing a good job defending their critical assets and don't forget they have best in class training and intelligence to help them just do that. - Russia has destroyed many military targets during the conflicts. Obviously both sides lie about their casualties. - Ukraine is backed by west and receives new supplies every day. Much more than publicized. The 12 HIMARS is not real. The actual figures are never shared, as it would be too foolish to give such information to the enemy.

deworms 4y ago

_kbh_ 4y ago
> It's because Ukraine has no military infrastructure to speak of, anymore. The common tactic thus far was to station military staff and supplies in civilian buildings, move them out before a strike if possible, then release a news report how Russians are targeting civilian installations. There is a reason this keeps happening, no one spends a billion dollars just shooting missiles at random. Russia 100% does, or else, if they where actually hitting military targets with these missiles they would of won the war by now. Russia uses these terror strikes on civilians as a method of waging war, an attempt to get the enemy to surrender. It's an act of terror, and just one of many war crimes Russia commits weekly.
- deworms 4y ago
  - _kbh_ 4y ago
    Every single city in Ukraine that Russia has occupied and subsequently left, and why not throw in Chechnya for fun as well. Russia is incapable of conducting proper military operations, its why they rely on their 20th century terror tactics. They haven't learnt that these tactics don't work all the time and can at times just embolden the populace against the enemy.
  - krzyk 4y ago
- eternalban 4y ago
  "The attacks lasted eleven weeks and, according to various estimates, in between 1,200 and 2,500 people were killed. Many buildings, businesses, schools, health centres, media headquarters and cultural monuments were severely damaged or destroyed. A group of economists from the G17 Plus party has estimated the total damages to be about 29.6 billion dollars." Google it. It wasn't the Russians.

foverzar 4y ago

WesolyKubeczek 4y ago
So now you have to be an expert to be able to tell whether a playground in a park is a military target or not.
- spaceheater 4y ago
  https://i.imgur.com/XVEpFHg.jpg https://i.imgur.com/XVEpFHg.jpg
  - _kbh_ 4y ago
    but Kyiv is no where near the front line, having any equipment like artillery deployed there makes no sense.
    - spaceheater 4y ago
      Honestly, I have no idea when and where this picture is from. And for the sake of argument let's say both sides use such tactics. However this does answer the question: "Why playgrounds and parks are targeted"
      - justsomehnguy 4y ago
        > idea when No later than February 26, 2022 https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t1sm0n/howitzers_in_densely_populated_area/ https://old.reddit.com/r/CombatFootage/comments/t1sm0n/howit... > and where Severodonetsk > Honestly, I have no idea when and where this picture is from If only someone made a search engine, which could search by an images...
- foverzar 4y ago
  One definitely doesn't even have to be an expert in rhetorics to identify your weak manipulations. 2 of like 100 missiles that might have just as well been shot down by the AA system (which, surprise, also shoot missiles, that might hit the target, or...). Yes, it seems to me you need at least some expertise or at least have some understanding of basic logic, or maybe at least a vague familiarity with the matter conservation law to ask yourself: Where do missiles shot down by an AA system go? Where do AA missiles, that didn't hit the target go?

ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago

Can you please stop giving out unofficial links? Here are the official ones: https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/support-the-armed-forces https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/support-the-armed-forces https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/humanitarian-aid-to-ukraine https://bank.gov.ua/en/about/humanitarian-aid-to-ukraine

_visgean 4y ago
The links that I posted are very much official. They are both projects of ukranian embassy in Prague. All the money will be used for direct weapons purchase. Again this is official project by the ukranian government (https://czechia.mfa.gov.ua/cs/news/sbirka-na-podporu-ukrajinske-armady https://czechia.mfa.gov.ua/cs/news/sbirka-na-podporu-ukrajin..., https://mil.in.ua/en/news/in-the-czech-republic-approximately-40-million-euros-have-been-donated-for-weapons-for-ukraine/ https://mil.in.ua/en/news/in-the-czech-republic-approximatel...). Yes the national bank has now some other options and that is cool but that does not make this project in any way unofficial.
- ThePowerOfFuet 4y ago
  The national bank was the very first and original option and is without doubt the most official and direct way to support Ukraine, be it military or humanitarian.