4 ms·

Deception can lead to false confessions (people's memories are very malleable) or plea bargains (accept 2 years vs risking 15 years).

giantg2 4y ago
Aren't those false confessions usually the result of the other tactics (long interrogations, intimidation, etc)? I'm wondering if there's some data on deception without these other factors. Even plea bargains aren't a bad thing except if they're abused.
- lucb1e 4y ago
  > usually the result of the other tactics (long interrogations, intimidation, etc)? That is definitely not required for a false confession. I don't have stats handy, but for another comment (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33146157 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33146157) I was reading up on the Dutch Wikipedia article on false confessions. Reasons for false confessions given there (https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valse_bekentenis https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valse_bekentenis) are: - Feeling guilty for what happened, even if it's not your fault - To protect the actual perpetrator - To receive benefits such as contact with one's family, stopping the interrogation, sentence reduction, or to prevent a loved one from also being (further) prosecuted - Due to a pathological need for attention or sensationalism - Thinking you are guilty due to memory problems or other psychological issues such as delusions In one case I heard in de podcast Napleiten, someone gave a false confession because the interviewers said they had video evidence, saying something along the lines of "if you have it on video then I guess I must have done it". She was a teenager, been interviewed for hours on end, and had barely slept the night before in the cell (after she came to the police the day before, expecting to clear up this apparent mix-up where she appeared on some wanted list). The public prosecutor brought a signed confession before the court. The Wikipedia article lists as measures that can lead to further pressure for a false confession: long interrogations, interrogations at unexpected moments, preventing rest or sleep, providing gruesome footage of the event, raising one's voice, saying they can prove it anyway so it is useless to deny it, and obviously things like actual torture (which I'd say sleep deprivation should also count as) or threats thereof. Some of these things might happen inadvertently, such as if someone is already dead on their feet due to no fault of the police's, or if they don't know/realize that discussing gruesome footage is a risk factor for a false confession.
  - giantg2 4y ago
    All those reasons you gave can happen with or without deception. The example you gave clearly had numerous other issues in it. I guess I'm still not seeing how deception would be a problem if we fixed the other issues - including not corroborating the confession (there are methods for this, even with limited evidence).

giantg2 4y ago

Aren't those false confessions usually the result of the other tactics (long interrogations, intimidation, etc)? I'm wondering if there's some data on deception without these other factors. Even plea bargains aren't a bad thing except if they're abused.

lucb1e 4y ago
> usually the result of the other tactics (long interrogations, intimidation, etc)? That is definitely not required for a false confession. I don't have stats handy, but for another comment (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33146157 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=33146157) I was reading up on the Dutch Wikipedia article on false confessions. Reasons for false confessions given there (https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valse_bekentenis https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valse_bekentenis) are: - Feeling guilty for what happened, even if it's not your fault - To protect the actual perpetrator - To receive benefits such as contact with one's family, stopping the interrogation, sentence reduction, or to prevent a loved one from also being (further) prosecuted - Due to a pathological need for attention or sensationalism - Thinking you are guilty due to memory problems or other psychological issues such as delusions In one case I heard in de podcast Napleiten, someone gave a false confession because the interviewers said they had video evidence, saying something along the lines of "if you have it on video then I guess I must have done it". She was a teenager, been interviewed for hours on end, and had barely slept the night before in the cell (after she came to the police the day before, expecting to clear up this apparent mix-up where she appeared on some wanted list). The public prosecutor brought a signed confession before the court. The Wikipedia article lists as measures that can lead to further pressure for a false confession: long interrogations, interrogations at unexpected moments, preventing rest or sleep, providing gruesome footage of the event, raising one's voice, saying they can prove it anyway so it is useless to deny it, and obviously things like actual torture (which I'd say sleep deprivation should also count as) or threats thereof. Some of these things might happen inadvertently, such as if someone is already dead on their feet due to no fault of the police's, or if they don't know/realize that discussing gruesome footage is a risk factor for a false confession.
- giantg2 4y ago
  All those reasons you gave can happen with or without deception. The example you gave clearly had numerous other issues in it. I guess I'm still not seeing how deception would be a problem if we fixed the other issues - including not corroborating the confession (there are methods for this, even with limited evidence).