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We have a strong legal system that protects employees. We should start working on it and strengthening it so every employee has protections instead of these hiv

We have a strong legal system that protects employees. We should start working on it and strengthening it so every employee has protections instead of these hived off unions. Unions started for factory workers and farm workers too when they had no rights. It’s entirely unnecessary and disruptive now to rely on unions that simply use an artifact of the past to bully employers and reduce productivity. In America, we have monetary as well as legal safety nets. Unions are used as political means to create vote banks in our current times. I think if politicians wants to mobilize voters to suit their own agenda, they should do it on their own time and on their own dime. Also: Union pension funds are humongous and public sector and govt employees pension funds are the main reason why we have pension fund liabilities and the some state’s economy gets manipulated. https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing-strategy/090916/how-do-pension-funds-work.asp https://www.investopedia.com/articles/investing-strategy/090... The California teachers Union is the most powerful union and voting block followed by correction officers union. The amount of political power they wield is often hidden from most people esp those who frequent places like HN. Tech workers Union and Starbucks unions make no sense. A powerful union needs hundreds of thousands of members. And billions of dollars. If tech workers and Starbucks employees Unionise, the entire economy of the USA would crumble and collapse simply from the macro economic impact. Not to mention their power over how our cities are run. Case in point, why can’t we build modular homes quickly in San Francisco so there is more housing and affordable ones at that. Unions oppose it. And people end up talking and fighting about NIMBYs and prop 13 by brainwashing kids in public schools(unionized teachers) and colleges(again unionized work force in state univs). Some little squirt still in high school will spout off about NIMBYs and I want to know where they got it from…instead of availing an education, we have an uneducated public school trained political mob. Kids just out of school would speak about Prop 13 and I am like..dude, pay your bills and your taxes. I mean..get a job first before you want to get grandma to sell her home to build your ‘walkable city’. https://norcalapa.org/2020/12/san-francisco-trade-unions-at-odds-over-modular-construction/ https://norcalapa.org/2020/12/san-francisco-trade-unions-at-... Most importantly: The amount of meddling and damage that this has caused our education sector is irreparable and irreversible. We have an entire generation of politically uneducated ignorant gaslit and easily manipulated youth because of the agenda driven public education they recd from our hard earned tax dollars. Worst investment ever. These youngsters that are the products of a useless public education system wanting to form unions while working in airconditioned work spaces are simply reflecting their education. Rebels without a cause probably never saw the James Dean movie. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebel_Without_a_Cause https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebel_Without_a_Cause https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/558095/facts-about-rebel-without-a-cause-james-dean https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/558095/facts-about-rebel... Unions are outdated. The law is universal for all in the USA..and it is a superior and effective system because it protects everyone from workers to employees to immigrants rights to undocumented workers. We should work on the law of the land and not on divisive pseudo political outfits like unions.

hey2022 4y ago
Hard to respond to such a long comment containing so many different talking points. I can’t tell if you are advocating for updating labor laws instead of relying on unions to influence individual employers. If that’s the case - that’s a strong argument. Since forcing stronger labor protections at the Federal or even State level takes a very long time and is usually counter-acted by extremely powerful corporate lobbying and propaganda (e.g. Uber), unions offer a more immediate and flexible alternative. Compared to most European countries, labor laws and benefits in the US are a joke. Unions fought for improving labor condition in Europe, and will hopefully fight for the same level of improvement in the US. Peeing into a bottle should not be OK at an Amazon warehouse, maternity leave should not be an optional benefit, “at-will” employment should not be the standard, etc etc
- jelliclesfarm 4y ago
  Why are we always comparing America to Europe? What if we compare America to China? America is America. We will have to do what’s best for us. Constant and random comparisons with other countries picked for simply beating down America isn’t helpful.
  - hey2022 4y ago
    Because humans strive to become better over time, not worse. Practicing gratitude is important, but if we fixate on "well, at least we are not Bangladesh", then we won't have much motivation to improve things.
    - jelliclesfarm 4y ago
      This is entirely irrelevant. In what way is America going to ‘become better’ by emulating European(a cluster of many countries) labour laws? European unemployment rates are much higher..at least 50% more..than American unemployment rates. There has been no relative increase in wages in Europe whereas it has been steadily increasing in America leading to better quality of life index. There is no comprehensive Europe vs USA comparison but this is a good read of how they dealt with the pandemic(most of the countries mentioned have less than 1/4 population of US) https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/world/pandemic-shows-contrasts-between-us-european-safety-nets https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/world/pandemic-shows-contra... There is no way to compare Europe to America but it serves better to compare America to China or India as USA is the third most populous country in the world after the other two. Comparing America to 5 million peopled NZ and 60 million peopled France is an entirely useless exercise. Unless the purpose of the comparison is to simply pit western countries with a majority white population with other countries with a white majority…therefore ignoring comparable countries from the east. And that’s is frankly Racist. China is more comparable to USA when it comes to economy than any other European country. But they are Asian, so it doesn’t count seems to be your stance.

hey2022 4y ago

Hard to respond to such a long comment containing so many different talking points. I can’t tell if you are advocating for updating labor laws instead of relying on unions to influence individual employers. If that’s the case - that’s a strong argument. Since forcing stronger labor protections at the Federal or even State level takes a very long time and is usually counter-acted by extremely powerful corporate lobbying and propaganda (e.g. Uber), unions offer a more immediate and flexible alternative. Compared to most European countries, labor laws and benefits in the US are a joke. Unions fought for improving labor condition in Europe, and will hopefully fight for the same level of improvement in the US. Peeing into a bottle should not be OK at an Amazon warehouse, maternity leave should not be an optional benefit, “at-will” employment should not be the standard, etc etc

jelliclesfarm 4y ago
Why are we always comparing America to Europe? What if we compare America to China? America is America. We will have to do what’s best for us. Constant and random comparisons with other countries picked for simply beating down America isn’t helpful.
- hey2022 4y ago
  Because humans strive to become better over time, not worse. Practicing gratitude is important, but if we fixate on "well, at least we are not Bangladesh", then we won't have much motivation to improve things.
  - jelliclesfarm 4y ago
    This is entirely irrelevant. In what way is America going to ‘become better’ by emulating European(a cluster of many countries) labour laws? European unemployment rates are much higher..at least 50% more..than American unemployment rates. There has been no relative increase in wages in Europe whereas it has been steadily increasing in America leading to better quality of life index. There is no comprehensive Europe vs USA comparison but this is a good read of how they dealt with the pandemic(most of the countries mentioned have less than 1/4 population of US) https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/world/pandemic-shows-contrasts-between-us-european-safety-nets https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/world/pandemic-shows-contra... There is no way to compare Europe to America but it serves better to compare America to China or India as USA is the third most populous country in the world after the other two. Comparing America to 5 million peopled NZ and 60 million peopled France is an entirely useless exercise. Unless the purpose of the comparison is to simply pit western countries with a majority white population with other countries with a white majority…therefore ignoring comparable countries from the east. And that’s is frankly Racist. China is more comparable to USA when it comes to economy than any other European country. But they are Asian, so it doesn’t count seems to be your stance.