4 ms·

Could you explain why? Do you think white men aren’t being discriminated against? Do you think white men are being discriminated against and just don’t like se

by jwond 4y ago

Could you explain why? Do you think white men aren’t being discriminated against? Do you think white men are being discriminated against and just don’t like seeing people talk about it? Or maybe some other reason?

sumeno 4y ago
Because we work in an industry and are posting on a website that is predominantly male and white. Any time even the smallest measures are taken to improve the balance there's just a bunch of whining about being discriminated against. It's as silly and unfounded as complaining how "foreigners are coming to take our jobs" It's the same attitude that makes it hard to recruit women and people of color into the industry, they can just look at one of the most well known platforms for discussing the industry and see the rampant sexism and racism
- jwond 4y ago
  When people are victims of discrimination based on their race or sex they are likely to complain about it. The fact that some people believe the discrimination is justified is little solace to someone who is actually subject to said discrimination. If that makes you feel gross then you’ll just have to deal with it I guess.
  - sumeno 4y ago
    Yes, when a privileged group begins to face a more equitable situation they often feel discriminated against, it doesn't make it true. White men still have incredible advantages in this industry and the half hearted diversity initiatives in the industry haven't changed that at all.
    - jwond 4y ago
      Treating people differently on the basis of race or sex is discrimination. Equity is explicitly about trying to force equality of outcome between different groups by discriminating against groups that have been deemed privileged and in favor of groups that have been deemed oppressed.
      - sumeno 4y ago
        If I help an elderly person across the street am I discriminating against the young? Are VA hospitals discriminating against non-veterans? If my neighbor's house is on fire is the fire department discriminating against me when they don't spray my house with water? We make accomodations for people in society all the time, it doesn't mean we are discriminating against people who aren't part of that group. Hiring practices in our industry have historically, and still do, overwhelmingly benefit white men. Making accomodations for other people to reduce that disparity is not discrimination. You STILL have the overwhelming advantage in the hiring process and are crying discrimination. It's absurd
        jwond 4y ago
        > Making accomodations for other people to reduce that disparity is not discrimination. Giving people different accommodations based on race or sex is discrimination no matter how many times you claim it is not. > Hiring practices in our industry have historically, and still do, overwhelmingly benefit white men. […] You STILL have the overwhelming advantage in the hiring process and are crying discrimination. It's absurd “Equity” as it is currently practiced is inherently unfair because it reduces everything down to race, sex, and other group identities and assumes that all white men are privileged while all women and non-white people are oppressed. Under the current equity framework a black person who was born into a wealthy family with loving parents, attended expensive private schools, and never wanted for anything is “oppressed” and deserves to be given special accommodations, while a white person born into extreme poverty with drug-addicted, absent parents is assumed to be a privileged oppressor. That is absurd.
        sumeno 4y ago
        The vast vast majority of interviewers and hiring managers in our industry are going to be white men. They will consciously or unconsciously tend to favor people like them, other white men, regardless of other factors due to human nature. Efforts to account for that are not discriminating against the white men, the discrimination is already happening to the people who aren't white men, accounting for that existing systematic discrimination is not reverse discrimination.

by jwond 4y ago

sumeno 4y ago

Because we work in an industry and are posting on a website that is predominantly male and white. Any time even the smallest measures are taken to improve the balance there's just a bunch of whining about being discriminated against. It's as silly and unfounded as complaining how "foreigners are coming to take our jobs" It's the same attitude that makes it hard to recruit women and people of color into the industry, they can just look at one of the most well known platforms for discussing the industry and see the rampant sexism and racism

jwond 4y ago
When people are victims of discrimination based on their race or sex they are likely to complain about it. The fact that some people believe the discrimination is justified is little solace to someone who is actually subject to said discrimination. If that makes you feel gross then you’ll just have to deal with it I guess.
- sumeno 4y ago
  Yes, when a privileged group begins to face a more equitable situation they often feel discriminated against, it doesn't make it true. White men still have incredible advantages in this industry and the half hearted diversity initiatives in the industry haven't changed that at all.
  - jwond 4y ago
    Treating people differently on the basis of race or sex is discrimination. Equity is explicitly about trying to force equality of outcome between different groups by discriminating against groups that have been deemed privileged and in favor of groups that have been deemed oppressed.
    - sumeno 4y ago
      If I help an elderly person across the street am I discriminating against the young? Are VA hospitals discriminating against non-veterans? If my neighbor's house is on fire is the fire department discriminating against me when they don't spray my house with water? We make accomodations for people in society all the time, it doesn't mean we are discriminating against people who aren't part of that group. Hiring practices in our industry have historically, and still do, overwhelmingly benefit white men. Making accomodations for other people to reduce that disparity is not discrimination. You STILL have the overwhelming advantage in the hiring process and are crying discrimination. It's absurd
      - jwond 4y ago
        > Making accomodations for other people to reduce that disparity is not discrimination. Giving people different accommodations based on race or sex is discrimination no matter how many times you claim it is not. > Hiring practices in our industry have historically, and still do, overwhelmingly benefit white men. […] You STILL have the overwhelming advantage in the hiring process and are crying discrimination. It's absurd “Equity” as it is currently practiced is inherently unfair because it reduces everything down to race, sex, and other group identities and assumes that all white men are privileged while all women and non-white people are oppressed. Under the current equity framework a black person who was born into a wealthy family with loving parents, attended expensive private schools, and never wanted for anything is “oppressed” and deserves to be given special accommodations, while a white person born into extreme poverty with drug-addicted, absent parents is assumed to be a privileged oppressor. That is absurd.
        sumeno 4y ago
        The vast vast majority of interviewers and hiring managers in our industry are going to be white men. They will consciously or unconsciously tend to favor people like them, other white men, regardless of other factors due to human nature. Efforts to account for that are not discriminating against the white men, the discrimination is already happening to the people who aren't white men, accounting for that existing systematic discrimination is not reverse discrimination.